Peppermint OS Community Forum

General => GNU/Linux Discussion => Topic started by: VinDSL on November 28, 2015, 12:33:16 am

Title: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: VinDSL on November 28, 2015, 12:33:16 am
For shiggles...   :D

SOFTPEDIA ARTICLE (27 Nov 2015, 20:41 GMT):  http://linux.softpedia.com/blog/windows-10-accurate-theme-released-for-almost-all-major-linux-desktops-496831.shtml

WINDOWS 10 THEME (GNOME-Look.org)  v0.7.9: http://gnome-look.org/content/show.php/Windows+10+Theme?content=171327

MORE INFO: http://b00merang.weebly.com/windows-10.html
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 28, 2015, 06:13:25 am
::) .. Why do people do this .. ::)

I'll now sit back and wait for the inevitable distro claiming it somehow makes life easier for Windows 10 converts .. will it be Zorin or will someone else beat them to it.
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: scifidude79 on November 28, 2015, 09:27:09 am
::) .. Why do people do this .. ::)

I was thinking the same thing.  If you want your OS to look like Windows 10, just run Windows 10!  Then it will look like Windows 10.
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: AndyInMokum on November 28, 2015, 09:42:33 am
::) .. Why do people do this .. ::)

I'll now sit back and wait for the inevitable distro claiming it somehow makes life easier for Windows 10 converts .. will it be Zorin or will someone else beat them to it.
They don't learn that it makes no significant difference.  In fact I think it turns more people away from Linux because many people perceive it as a cheap knock off  Windows wannabe OS.  When I moved to Mac, (yes I used to use a G4 PowerBook) I didn't want it looking like Windows XP.  It's the same for Mac users moving to Windows.  They want a Windows machine not a Mac look alike.  If you move to Linux, get stuck in and use it as a Linux machine.  If you're unable to do that, then Linux is the wrong platform for you.  These Windows shells are not even very clever because the similarities are so superficial.  I think if as much effort was put into promoting the Linux desktop for what it is, as is being put into tricking new users.  We'd have a lot larger share.  Not that I particularly care how many users there are.  I just don't like attracting potential new users by dangling false hopes in front of their eyes ;).
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: scifidude79 on November 28, 2015, 09:49:38 am
Yeah, you hit the nail on the head, Andy.  It does make Linux seem like a cheap knockoff.  The Linux desktops are strong enough to stand on their own, they don't need to try and emulate Windows, or Mac OS, or anything else.  When I first started making my move to Linux in 2009, I loved the fact that Ubuntu's Gnome 2 interface was so radically different from Windows Vista.  It was all fresh and exciting to me.  Then I tried some of the other desktops and liked how different they were too.  I personally never needed it to look like Windows, because I knew I was trying something way different from Windows.  If new users don't feel that way, they're definitely in the wrong place.

When I moved to Mac, (yes I used to use a G4 PowerBook)

Don't worry, we forgive you.  :))
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: AndyInMokum on November 28, 2015, 10:04:13 am
Quote
When I moved to Mac, (yes I used to use a G4 PowerBook)
In my defense, it was a nice machine, built like a tank   :o.  The 80GB HDD finally died a couple of years ago with Ubuntu 12.04 LTS PPC installed ;).
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: scifidude79 on November 28, 2015, 10:07:08 am
Yeah, I've heard some of the older Apple stuff is really well built.  I don't know about the newer stuff, I don't know if their quality is where it once was.  (I've read some bad stories)  I know their prices are.  ::)
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: emegra on November 28, 2015, 02:28:18 pm
Yeah I don't see any point in windows clone/lookalike themes and I don't think it makes the transition from Windows to Linux any easier in fact I would argue it makes it more difficult in a paradoxical sort of way.

I've moved a few friends a family members over to Linux and I've I've always tried to make sure it doesn't look  or feel like Windows because I think it's important they know they're using a different operating system



Graeme
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 28, 2015, 03:02:01 pm
Basically why ? .. if they can't figure out it's point and click like Windows and that the menu is on the panel/taksbar .. they shouldn't be allowed ANY PC/OS

I mean is it really that different to "use" :-\ .. it has clickable icons, it has a cursor, it has a panel/taskbar, it has a start/menu, it has right-click context menus .. where's the difference that a skin is going to help with ?



Sure, digging around Linux internals reveals major differences, but if you're going digging would you want to be confused by it looking like Windows ?
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: zebedeeboss on November 29, 2015, 03:47:35 pm
Ask and you shall receive PCNetSpec

(http://i.imgur.com/gOWNBLl.jpg) - http://makululinux.com/aero/ (http://makululinux.com/aero/)

Looks like the first one has arrived, although in fairness to Makulu it has been in development for several months...

Why do they do it  - cos they can

Does it hurt that they try - No.      Now I know most of you here are dead against it... but there are people out there who want it.   They are not Die Hard Linux fans, they just want something other than windows but yet they want to feel "at home"

Does it look good...   Dunno only just installed it...    Is it fast... it seems to be...

Now... Can anyone spot the really weird thing about this distro ?

and it listed my HDD in a way completely different to every single distro I have ever hopped.  It shows my 1st HDD as /dev/sdc and my SSD as /dev/sdd       they are usually a and b.   It picked up two USB ext Seagate Backup drives and they are sda and sdb respectively.  So I wonder how they scan for HDD differently than everyone else.

Lets use this for a day or two and see what other oddities it throws up.
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 29, 2015, 04:19:38 pm
That looks more like Vista/Win7 than Win10

I'm not saying they shouldn't do it, I'd not be presumptuous enough to tell people what they should or shouldn't do .. doesn't mean I have to agree it's useful in ANY way though.

Quote
but there are people out there who want it.   They are not Die Hard Linux fans, they just want something other than windows but yet they want to feel "at home"

There's not even anecdotal evidence there .. and assuming people want it to look like Windows just because people download it would be a circular argument where you're drawing a conclusions from the premise itself.

and "because they can" was never really a strong or reasoned argument now was it ;)

Simply show me HOW it helps people ? .. and I'll be happy to admit I'm wrong :)
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: zebedeeboss on November 29, 2015, 04:51:34 pm
That looks more like Vista/Win7 than Win10
If you watch his "Aero taster" video he shows the themes and how you can select all  XP  or Vista or Win 7 or Win10  items to give you your prefered view of things.

Quote
There's not even anecdotal evidence there .. and assuming people want it to look like Windows just because people download it would be a circular argument where you're drawing a conclusions from the premise itself.
again read his website. He says he made it cos he simply had so many requests.

Quote
and "because they can" was never really a strong or reasoned argument now was it ;)

It doesn't have to be a strong and reasoned argument, when it's your passion.  Where would we be if someone back in the day didn't put a sidewinder exhaust on a truck or a subwoofer and other sundry "ICE" costing 000's of pounds in the boot.  Doesn't need to have any reason other than "I enjoyed doing it"

Quote
Simply show me HOW it helps them ?

Different strokes for different folks - all our brains read things and learn things differently. Show somebody Linux but make it "look" familiar and they soon forget its not Windows cos they get "used" to it.  Then show them how they can change things to suit themselves even more and before they know it, they are simply USING Linux and how it looks or how its styled is neither here nor there.  I have been teaching, or trying to teach, Joe Bloggs to get the most out of their PC at work (and with friends) for nigh on 25 yrs and I will take any tool at my disposal to help in that goal so that eventually they don't need me any more cos they have found their own way. Now if one of those tools is "PsychobabbleBSLooknFeel" then give me a few bucket loads please  ;D

Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: emegra on November 29, 2015, 05:15:07 pm
I don't think there is one practical reason why a Windows lookalike theme makes moving to Linux any easier although there may be psychological reasons but that's where I would argue it actually makes it more difficult as anyone who has tried to give up smoking by gradual reduction will tell you, it just makes it harder, it's  really easier to stop completely,

in my view the easiest way to transition from Windows is to use a distro that looks as different from Windows as possible because no Windows clone no matter how well done can ever be as good at being Windows as Windows, and if they can't learn how to use any modern mainstream Linux distro they should have never tried transitioning in the first place and just go back to using Windows because they were obviously never serious about transitioning in the first place or were talked into it against their will

imitation is said to be the sincerest form of flattery, do microsoft really deserve that



Graeme
 
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: perknh on November 29, 2015, 05:40:13 pm
::) .. Why do people do this .. ::)

I don't know.  I have a very smart friend who always sees this principle at work in American politics.  There will always be some Democrat running for office who will try to talk more like a Republican, and act more like a Republican, than a real Republican --and it never works.  A Democrat just can't out-Republican a Republican --nor should she or he try.

And this same principle applies to Linux:  Linux just can't out-Windows Windows  --but why would we want to?  MInt's Cinnamon edition is as close to a Windows look in Linux as we need to go.

Now swiping a few of  Windows wallpapers, in the name of good sportsmanship (which helps educate our Windows friends about open source principles) --now that's an entirely different story! ;D
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: AndyInMokum on November 29, 2015, 07:29:15 pm
Quote
I don't know.  I have a very smart friend who always sees this principle at work in American politics.  There will always be some Democrat running for office who will try to talk more like a Republican, and act more like a Republican, than a real Republican --and it never works.  A Democrat just can't out-Republican a Republican --nor should she or he try. :- perknh
Maybe these Windows look alike desktops should be labelled: HCDE's  :D!!
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: zebedeeboss on November 30, 2015, 03:24:44 am
Morning update...

No matter how "Cool" it looks if the back end system is not upto scratch then then the "Look n feel" is a mute point.

Not sure how many spotted or even looked at terminal window in the screen shot - the title bar permanently says
"Use update Manager to Update System, Do not use ..."  and then it gives the usual upgrade and dist upgrade commands - this is explained on the website - sort of but is a serious limitation for the system.  Wake up foggy one morning, auto takes over  ctrl+t sudo apt-g...    blah blah blah   oh bugga    one borked system.

So I used the supplied driver manger to install the recommended nvidia drivers... rebooted -   :o FAIL
this mornings Update Manager.... FAIL    due to the above... Took my usual sledgehammer approach - re-install

Left it on graphics drivers it comes with.... Update Manager now working again

Oh wait... now Clementine is not working and not listing all the music I drag into it....   pause....     wait....    :o  :o EPIC FAIL... sorry but I have stated many times before and I will again.  The Basics have to work to get on my "approved list" to recommend to my friends.

Peppermint is still No1   :D
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: GNULINUX on November 30, 2015, 05:42:48 am
As a relatively new Linux and Peppermint user I like to give my opinion on the subject...

Before I installed any Linux distro on a real machine, I've installed many flavors in VirtualBox (on Windows 7) to test. If it looked like Windows or not was NEVER a requirement! It just has to do the things I wanted and was used to do in Windows.

The only criteria I had where a nice and useful (start)menu, plenty of software with a User Interface and the fact that the whole OS was stable. I find it normal that things are done different but if you have the same (or better) functions at the end, I don't see a problem... It's just a learning curve like you have with ANY OS. You can search the internet for solutions or ask for help on a forum.

Ok, I like a nice desktop but I'm not going to dress my Peppermint as any Windows, not now, not ever!
And you know why? Because it makes me search for my C-drive and I can't find it...  :D

For the same reason I'm not going to dress my Windows 7 (I'm dual booting) as any Linux...
Because at that point I open CMD and type "sudo apt..." fail...  :D

If other people find help in making a system look like another, I'm ok with that.
I don't because it makes it more confusing for me!

Integrating ideas of other OS's is great but just copying the look of them falls too short for me...  ;)
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: perknh on November 30, 2015, 05:49:12 am
Maybe these Windows look alike desktops should be labelled: HCDE's  :D!!

Only in Peppermint forum would you ever learn what these DEs are really called!

Good one, AndyInMokum!

  :o... 8)... :D
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: AndyInMokum on November 30, 2015, 07:08:37 am
Quote
Oh wait... now Clementine is not working and not listing all the music I drag into it....   pause....     wait....    :o  :o EPIC FAIL... sorry but I have stated many times before and I will again.  The Basics have to work to get on my "approved list" to recommend to my friends.
Disaster - no Clementine, no go!  Clementine is always one of the first packages I install.  In my opinion, it's the best audio player on any platform  ;)!
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: Slim.Fatz on November 30, 2015, 07:50:34 am
Maybe these Windows look alike desktops should be labelled: HCDE's  :D !!

Hi AndyInMokum,

I guess I am out of touch with the real world ... I don't have a clue what HCDE means!?!  :-\

I googled HCDE and found two candidates:  1. Human Centered Design & Engineering (the most reasonable, I suppose); or 2. Hamilton County Department of Education (rather unlikely).

Regards,

-- Slim
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: scifidude79 on November 30, 2015, 09:31:10 am
Dressing up your Linux OS to look like Windows is a lot like turkey bacon.  Bacon is yummy, one of the best tasting meats on the planet.  However, bacon is also very bad for you.  It's loaded with fat, bad cholesterol and sodium.  Turkey is also yummy.  It's a hell of a lot better for your health than bacon is.  Now, if you tell a bacon eater that they can't eat bacon anymore because it's bad for their health and that they have to switch to eating turkey instead because it's good for them, they'll whine about it and say it's not as good as bacon, but they'll eventually learn the merits of turkey on their own and be better for it.  However, some companies make what's called turkey bacon.  Turkey bacon is an attempt to make turkey look, smell and taste exactly like bacon.  They use natural and artificial flavors to try and make the turkey as much like bacon as possible.  However, it doesn't taste like bacon.  (I know, I've had it)  It tastes different.  Now, some people will claim it tastes exactly the same as bacon, but those people are full of crap.  It's not bacon and it's never going to be bacon.  So, some people will limp along trying to delude themselves into thinking that the turkey bacon is bacon, whereas others will be miserable and will wind up going back to the real thing.  However, had they just substituted the real bacon for regular turkey in the first place, they may have just stopped eating bacon entirely and gone to turkey instead.

That's what dressing up your OS to look like Windows is.  It's not Windows, it's never going to be Windows.  It may look like Windows, but it won't act and feel like Windows.  However, if you give a Windows user a completely different DE and flat out tell them the OS isn't Windows and will never be Windows, they may try it with Gnome, KDE, XFCE, LXDE, or whatever (Peppermint DE is pretty awesome)  and wind up finding they like it just as well as or even better than Windows.

anyone who has tried to give up smoking by gradual reduction will tell you, it just makes it harder

It worked for me.
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: emegra on November 30, 2015, 03:05:47 pm
Quote
It worked for me.

I wondered who'd be the first to say that  ;D




Graeme
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: perknh on November 30, 2015, 03:26:03 pm
Maybe these Windows look alike desktops should be labelled: HCDE's  :D !!

Hi AndyInMokum,

I guess I am out of touch with the real world ... I don't have a clue what HCDE means!?!  :-\

I googled HCDE and found two candidates:  1. Human Centered Design & Engineering (the most reasonable, I suppose); or 2. Hamilton County Department of Education (rather unlikely).

Regards,

-- Slim

Let me answer this one, Andy, please --since Slim.Fatz is fortunately busy with his own life in another location on this planet.

Here in the States we're getting hot into a presidential campaign season, and there is one quite famous gal who's been talking up a tough game lately --especially against ISIS.  The HC you see in HCDE is this famous politician's first and last initials -- a woman who you may read about in the news every now and then.

Therefore an HCDE is any DE masquerading as another OS's DE.  It's a pretentious DE --pretending to be like (or trying to create the appearance to be like) something that it is not.

Andy was spot on with this observation.  May his karmic points now grow by leaps and bounds! :)
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: Slim.Fatz on November 30, 2015, 04:02:36 pm
Hi perknh,

Ahaaa !! Now it is clear. Thanks for the help! As I recall, back when Bill was in the White House, people said that he was always one jump ahead of many Repoob plans -- simply by adopting them as his own before they had a chance to claim the idea as their own. Whether that is true or not, I really don't know ...  ;D

Regards,

--Slim
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: AndyInMokum on November 30, 2015, 04:32:48 pm
Quote
It worked for me.

I wondered who'd be the first to say that  ;D




Graeme
'twas cold turkey for me three years ago on 9 Dec 2012.  Never touched one since.  I had a heart attack and the quack told me to quit.  Fear is a marvelous motivator  ;D!!
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: perknh on November 30, 2015, 04:35:39 pm
Hi perknh,

Ahaaa !! Now it is clear. Thanks for the help! As I recall, back when Bill was in the White House, people said that he was always one jump ahead of many Repoob plans -- simply by adopting them as his own before they had a chance to claim the idea as their own. Whether that is true or not, I really don't know ...  ;D

Regards,

--Slim

Hi Slim.Fatz,

Actually that's true.  Bill did move the Democratic Party further to the right, and HC actually began her political life as a Republican!  So, who knows?

perknh
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 30, 2015, 10:36:38 pm
Quote
He says he made it cos he simply had so many requests.

Not sure I believe that .. AFAIK nobody has ever requested Peppermint have a  Windows theme  :-\

I'm guessing he probably posted a screenshot of one he did for a joke .. THEN people requested it, and he mistook their also wanting it as a joke as "enthusiasm"

Either that or maybe the Makulakululu hippo attracts the wrong kind (age?) of user ;)
(not taking the pi**, just can't remember its proper name)
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: zebedeeboss on December 01, 2015, 01:43:37 am
Not sure I believe that .. AFAIK nobody has ever requested Peppermint have a  Windows theme  :-\

Let me be the first then  :P  Can we have a Windows theme please so I can tell people not only is Peppermint OS the best out there but if you're feeling lonely or winsome *Cough *Cough you can flick the switch and and spend an hour realising why you made the change to Linux in the first place  :D

Quote
Either that or maybe the Makulakululu hippo attracts the wrong kind (age?) of user ;)

Erm...   turned 57 here today... so age has nowt to do with it  :D (altho my wife does say I act like a big kid most days :D :D :D )
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: scifidude79 on December 01, 2015, 09:27:19 am
Quote
It worked for me.

I wondered who'd be the first to say that  ;D

Well, it did.  I quit using that method in 2006 and haven't had a cigarette since.
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: emegra on December 01, 2015, 12:27:11 pm
Quote
Well, it did.  I quit using that method in 2006 and haven't had a cigarette since.

I never said you didn't
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: PCNetSpec on December 01, 2015, 02:38:23 pm
Let me be the first then  :P  Can we have a Windows theme please

You do know the answer to that, right ? ;)
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: zebedeeboss on December 01, 2015, 02:39:51 pm
Let me be the first then  :P  Can we have a Windows theme please

You do know the answer to that, right ? ;)

Yeah... refer to the options in the 1st post on this thread  :P
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: PCNetSpec on December 01, 2015, 02:49:41 pm
I'd probably have phrased it slightly differently but yeah ;) .. Zebedee was always the smart one :)
(at least compared to Dougal, Ermintrude, and my personal favourite Dylan)
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: emegra on December 01, 2015, 03:00:47 pm
Honestly making Peppermint look like Windows is a bit like wanting your Mercedes to look like a Morris Oxford, far better just to install Windows and you can have it run like a Morris Oxford as well






Graeme
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: zebedeeboss on December 01, 2015, 03:24:29 pm
Honestly making Peppermint look like Windows is a bit like wanting your Mercedes to look like a Morris Oxford, far better just to install Windows and you can have it run like a Morris Oxford as well

Graeme

I had to have my Morris "pimped" out to take all the HDD's  (https://farm4.static.flickr.com/3038/3087421507_a7a049db05.jpg)  :o

but it still runs sweet as....
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: emegra on December 01, 2015, 04:17:47 pm
Quote
I had to have my Morris "pimped" out to take all the HDD's

That's nice very nice indeed and in peppermint red, it;s amazing what you can do with a few Minor alterations  :)





Graeme




Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: scifidude79 on December 01, 2015, 11:30:00 pm
Let me be the first then  :P  Can we have a Windows theme please

You do know the answer to that, right ? ;)

The answer is yes, provided you make it yourself.  :P

Quote
Well, it did.  I quit using that method in 2006 and haven't had a cigarette since.

I never said you didn't

I never said you said I didn't. ;)  I was merely pointing out that it does work.  Really, quitting is different for each person and different methods work for different people.  Whether or not a person is successful comes down to willpower.  Much like quitting Windows.  ;)  Hell, it was harder for me to quit Windows than it was to quit smoking.
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: emegra on December 02, 2015, 01:56:21 am
Quote
I never said you said I didn't. ;)  I was merely pointing out that it does work.  Really, quitting is different for each person and different methods work for different people.  Whether or not a person is successful comes down to willpower.  Much like quitting Windows.  ;)  Hell, it was harder for me to quit Windows than it was to quit smoking.

I know what you're saying, I only used the gradual reduction analogy as a way of pointing out that I think it's often harder to come off something that way ie as far as I understand Nicorette patches (which is gradual reduction) has a 95% failure rate and I still believe for most people gradual reduction only makes it harder and ultimately doesn't work it certainly didn't for me and I think the same applies for people moving from Windows to Linux,

Linux is not Windows and it shouldn't look or feel like Windows and any attempt to do so is a deception, I've moved a few people over to Linux and I used to bend over backwards to help them adapt to it because I somehow felt responsible but now my outlook is

This is Linux this is how it works it's different from Windows but it's just as easy to use, there is a learning curve so if you need any help let me know but if it's too much effort to learn it then go back to Windows




Graeme
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: scifidude79 on December 02, 2015, 10:30:50 am
Yeah, Nicorette, Nicoderm, etc. is all bad because it still feeds the source of the addiction, the nicotine.  Then they have those electronic cigarettes now that also deliver nicotine but with "harmless" water vapor.  (my mom knows somebody who got seriously ill off of the "harmless" water vapor)  Substituting one addiction for another never works because the source of the addiction is still there.  Quitting smoking is mental and it requires the strength of will to power through some serious cravings.  Having something else to occupy your time helps, having another source of nicotine doesn't.  I had a hobby that helped me get through it.

As for the whole Windows/Linux thing, I agree with all of your points, Graeme.  Linux is different.  Not bad different, just different.  People need to realize that from the start.

Though, honestly, what keeps people in Windows isn't the way it looks.  Program compatibility is what keeps people there and no theme in the world will add that compatibility to Linux.  Switching to Linux is a matter of not only learning different ways of doing things, but also of finding software alternatives.
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: GNULINUX on December 05, 2015, 11:04:45 am
Though, honestly, what keeps people in Windows isn't the way it looks.  Program compatibility is what keeps people there and no theme in the world will add that compatibility to Linux.  Switching to Linux is a matter of not only learning different ways of doing things, but also of finding software alternatives.
+1

And Hardware compatibility (driver support)... but that's not the fault of Linux!  ;)
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: scifidude79 on December 05, 2015, 11:29:45 pm
True, hardware support is an ongoing issue and one that is the fault of the OEMs.  However, when a piece of hardware doesn't work, they aren't always the ones who get the blame.  A lot of people point the finger at Linux itself, like it's Linus Torvalds' or other Linux coders' responsibility to create drivers for everything.
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: AndyInMokum on December 06, 2015, 02:12:44 am
True, hardware support is an ongoing issue and one that is the fault of the OEMs.  However, when a piece of hardware doesn't work, they aren't always the ones who get the blame.  A lot of people point the finger at Linux itself, like it's Linus Torvalds' or other Linux coders' responsibility to create drivers for everything.
That's the truth.  It's something the Linux critics love to falsely use and spread.  This is why the majority of Windows only users believe that the hardware and software incompatibilities are a deficiency of the Linux kernel.   Rather than merely, the shortsightedness and laziness of the OEMs and their bean counters.
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: scifidude79 on December 06, 2015, 09:22:02 am
True, hardware support is an ongoing issue and one that is the fault of the OEMs.  However, when a piece of hardware doesn't work, they aren't always the ones who get the blame.  A lot of people point the finger at Linux itself, like it's Linus Torvalds' or other Linux coders' responsibility to create drivers for everything.
That's the truth.  It's something the Linux critics love to falsely use and spread.  This is why the majority of Windows only users believe that the hardware and software incompatibilities are a deficiency of the Linux kernel.   Rather than merely, the shortsightedness and laziness of the OEMs and their bean counters.

Right.  Plus, those same users completely ignore the fact that there are plenty of incompatibilities with Windows.  I mean, who doesn't remember the Vista roll out, where hardly anything, especially printers, had Vista drivers?  That was fun.  Though, in all fairness, I do believe many of them did blame Vista itself, as most computer users don't know (or care) where their drivers come from, they simply want their stuff working.
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: AndyInMokum on December 06, 2015, 09:28:42 am
...Right.  Plus, those same users completely ignore the fact that there are plenty of incompatibilities with Windows.  I mean, who doesn't remember the Vista roll out, where hardly anything, especially printers, had Vista drivers?  That was fun.  Though, in all fairness, I do believe many of them did blame Vista itself, as most computer users don't know (or care) where their drivers come from, they simply want their stuff working.
Vista - Vista was a walk in the park compared to Windows ME.  What an unmitigated piece of garbage that was  >:(!!
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: scifidude79 on December 06, 2015, 09:54:10 am
...Right.  Plus, those same users completely ignore the fact that there are plenty of incompatibilities with Windows.  I mean, who doesn't remember the Vista roll out, where hardly anything, especially printers, had Vista drivers?  That was fun.  Though, in all fairness, I do believe many of them did blame Vista itself, as most computer users don't know (or care) where their drivers come from, they simply want their stuff working.
Vista - Vista was a walk in the park compared to Windows ME.  What an unmitigated piece of garbage that was  >:(!!

Yes, indeed it was.  Windows ME is the worst version of Windows I've ever used.  It was a hot mess that seemed like half 98SE and half XP and the two halves didn't agree with each other.  I hated that piece of garbage with a vengeance.  I bought the "upgrade" after it was released, not knowing anything about it other than it was the new Windows.  After dealing with an endless stream of BSODs, I finally upgraded back to 98SE.  That was when I started being wary of new Windows releases and stopped getting them right after they were out.  Instead, I started waiting for reviews to be up before spending $100 on a potential dud upgrade.

The only reason I even had Vista was because I needed a new computer in 2008 and that was what was available.  I tried to find XP, but to no avail on anything that I actually wanted to buy.  Though, since Vista's compatibility issues pushed me towards Linux, I can't say it was a totally bad thing.  ;)
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: PCNetSpec on December 06, 2015, 10:02:03 am
Windows 10 is doing them no favours either .. I have 2 brand new HP laptops (but this problem is NOT limited to HP laptops), both need the Synaptics touchpad driver updating with one from Synaptics themselves, but Win10 won't let you ::)

The touchpad drivers that come with Windows 10 are broken, they loose any custom settings every time you reboot .. so you install the ones from Synaptic right ? .. yeah that works for a few days, then Windows 10 downgrades them back to the ones Microsoft are pushing (in an attempt to unify drivers for all Win10 users).

So you hunt the interweb and discover there's a (well hidden) way to disable "driver" updates ... great right ? .. wrong .. so after disabling automatic driver updates you reload the working touchpad driver from Synaptic only to (a few days later) discover Win10 completely ignores that setting and downgrades the touchpad driver back to the broken one anyway >:(

BTW, you'll REALLY want to change the default settings because scrolling is upside down, and there's no single finger scrolling (amongst other stupid default settings).

It's not as though Microsoft don't know about this problem (not only is it all over the web and HP, and Lenovo, etc. forums, but it's all over their own forums) .. it's just that they're doing nothing about it
(don't believe me .. google windows 10 synaptics)

Recently I've discovered 2 registry edits to fix the 2 problems with the drivers that come with Win10...

the first instructs the touchpad driver NOT to reset the driver to defaults every time it's reinstalled .. which must mean the default Win10 driver is thinking it's being reinstalled every boot
That fixes the touchpad settings being returned to defaults every boot, but it does NOT stop the tick being removed from "Disable internal pointing device when a USB mouse is attached" every boot .. that needs a second edit to the registry.

Microsoft .. do you think Joe Average is going to be able work this out ?

[EDIT]

I know I've mentioned this before, but it'd been driving me nuts.....
Title: Re: Windows 10 Accurate Linux Theme Released for Almost All Major Desktops
Post by: scifidude79 on December 06, 2015, 11:54:44 am
No, it's probably way worse than MS thinking Joe Average can figure this out.  Remember, MS thinks their entire user base is a bunch of computer illiterate morons who can't work things out.  That's why they try to have the OS do the thinking for them.  This is them actually trying to be helpful.  They'd probably rather have broken drivers in their OS than have Joe Average go through the terribly complex (extreme sarcasm) process of installing drivers.  They probably think this thing that you hate actually makes the thing easier to use.