Peppermint OS Community Forum

General => General Discussion => Topic started by: HannahIsabelle on May 30, 2017, 05:07:44 pm

Title: Best Browser
Post by: HannahIsabelle on May 30, 2017, 05:07:44 pm
So Im gettting tired of all these default browsers Chrome, Chromium, Firefox, Opera what are the best ones that you have found
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: mac on May 30, 2017, 05:25:08 pm
In my experience Opera has worked best with Peppermint on my machines.  I like Vivaldi but have found it to be a bit slow.  Iridium is fast but I'm not sold on its security.  YMMV, however.   ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on May 30, 2017, 05:29:31 pm
I'm a long time Firefox user.

But if you're looking for something to keep you busy, why not try getting Farmville to work in Lynx :)
just in case you didn't spot it .. that's my weird sense of humour at work)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: HannahIsabelle on May 30, 2017, 05:30:56 pm
In my experience Opera has worked best with Peppermint on my machines.  I like Vivaldi but have found it to be a bit slow.  Iridium is fast but I'm not sold on its security.  YMMV, however.   ;)
going to give Vivaldi a try looks like a solid browser
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: AndyInMokum on May 30, 2017, 05:57:26 pm
So Im gettting tired of all these default browsers Chrome, Chromium, Firefox, Opera what are the best ones that you have found

All of the above are tried, tested and trusted  ;).  If you're looking for something a little different, try Vivaldi: https://vivaldi.com/ (https://vivaldi.com/).  Select the DEB file for your machine, 32-bit or 64-bit.  Double click on the download to install.   This is now compatible with Peppermint's ICE application  ;).  You could also try Pale Moon: https://www.palemoon.org/.   This is built from a fork of the Firefox/Mozilla code.  To install:
Code: [Select]
cd ~ && wget http://linux.palemoon.org/datastore/release/pminstaller-0.2.3.tar.bz2
Extract the tarball contents by double clicking on it.  In the Nemo file manager in your /home folder, locate the script, pminstaller.sh.  Double click on it and select, Run.  Enter your user password and follow the on screen instructions.   You could go superlight with Mirdori.  This one is in the repository.  To install it run the following command in a terminal window:
Code: [Select]
sudo apt install midori
I hope this helps - have fun  ;).
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: HannahIsabelle on May 30, 2017, 06:03:53 pm
Went with fire fox  :o ::)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: scifidude79 on May 30, 2017, 07:56:48 pm
Well, if you're looking for alternatives Peppermint's default, Chromium, there's always Comodo Dragon, SRWare Iron, Epix, Yandex and Torch.  ::)  (not to mention Opera, but that one is a bit less obvious)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on May 30, 2017, 09:23:51 pm
In my experience Opera has worked best with Peppermint on my machines.

+1

I prefer the dev branch, but the stable ver was recently updated to include the features I liked the most, in the dev release.

Heh !  Does that make sense ?

Put another way, I like them both equally, today.

Did I mention, it provides *FREE* unlimited VPN ?   8)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: drowzee1872 on May 30, 2017, 09:38:20 pm
Opera has had a bit of a facelift of late. Does the job for me.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on May 31, 2017, 12:15:35 am
I use Firefox on Peppermint.
Have Chrome sandboxed for Netflix use... somehow it doesn't work with Firefox, although it should according to the website.

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Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: scifidude79 on May 31, 2017, 12:38:10 am
Netflix worked with Firefox last time I tried it.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on May 31, 2017, 01:16:53 am
When was that?
It's not working for me...
Maybe because I'm in Sweden...

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Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: zebedeeboss on May 31, 2017, 02:39:29 am
https://forum.peppermintos.com/index.php/topic,903.0.html (https://forum.peppermintos.com/index.php/topic,903.0.html)

A good previous discussion on Alternative browsers, if you're still undecided

Regards Zeb...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: berliner58 on May 31, 2017, 05:22:49 am
I usually have 3 browsers installed.  ( Firefox, Slimjet and Opera )

My standard browser is Slimjet. 
http://www.slimjet.com/?lang=en
 (http://www.slimjet.com/?lang=en)
I like Opera too because of the free VPN. Especially in Win10 ( I need it for some apps like Word ).

In linux, I usually install Bitmask and surf anonymously.
https://bitmask.net/install (https://bitmask.net/install)

Why firefox ?
Because sometimes streaming videos will not play in Opera or Slimjet (which is based on chrome), but they play in firefox.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on May 31, 2017, 06:54:40 am
FF has "supposed" to have supported Netflix DRM for the last couple of releases .. but I don't have a Netflix account so can't test it.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: scifidude79 on May 31, 2017, 10:13:21 am
FF has "supposed" to have supported Netflix DRM for the last couple of releases .. but I don't have a Netflix account so can't test it.

I'm on it.

Yep, it's working on Firefox 53.0.3 64-bit, running on Peppermint 7 on my media PC.   No Flash plugin, just straight HTML5 playback.

I don't know if location makes a difference with Netflix on there.  One would think it doesn't, but then it may.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on May 31, 2017, 10:19:46 am
Thanks Chris :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on May 31, 2017, 11:02:13 am
Can try again tonight.
Might have been something temporary.
I remember it said something like "you seem to be using an outdated version of FF", although I have the latest version installed.
...but as said I'll try again tonight

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Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on May 31, 2017, 03:25:12 pm
So, now I have tried it again and it doesn't work...suck! Firefox 53.0.3
I have to keep that google chrome in the sandbox after all...it works from there.

Sweden, as I understand, is bit like the US when it comes to linux use.
For example, I'd to find a work arround in order to loggin to my bank, because they (and no bank in Sweden) do not support logging in through linux.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on June 03, 2017, 07:01:49 am
For Netflix to work in Firefox, you may have to enable "Play DRM Content".

Copy this into your firefox address bar:
Code: [Select]
about:preferences#content
and hit enter.

And make sure you have a tick in "Play DRM Content"

Also be aware that it may take a short while before Netflix starts working on your first visit.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on June 03, 2017, 08:57:45 am
Cheers! I will try later.

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Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: AndyInMokum on June 03, 2017, 11:46:06 am
For Netflix to work in Firefox, you may have to enable "Play DRM Content".

Copy this into your firefox address bar:
Code: [Select]
about:preferences#content
and hit enter.

And make sure you have a tick in "Play DRM Content"

Also be aware that it may take a short while before Netflix starts working on your first visit.

I enabled, Play DRM Content.   NETFLIX is now running like a champ through Firefox 50.0.3 (64-bit) on my BabyDell Latitude D430.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on June 03, 2017, 12:01:50 pm
It works now! Thanks!
I also had to enable "remember history" otherwise it woundn't start.

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Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on June 03, 2017, 12:11:36 pm
...but now I have another question...
I have the .deb package of Google Chrome in my download folder, but when I run sudo apt-get remove/purge it says
"E: Unable to locate package ..."
How do I remove it?

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Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on June 03, 2017, 12:19:52 pm
Forget it, its done...
sudo dpkg -r google-chrome-stabel
was the command needed.

Thanks for Netflix with Firefox

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Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on June 03, 2017, 12:31:51 pm
Nice .. but if anyone you should thank this guy :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLHjEz7S8lk
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on August 06, 2017, 10:43:13 am
In my experience Opera has worked best with Peppermint on my machines.

+1

I prefer the dev branch, but the stable ver was recently updated to include the features I liked the most, in the dev release.

Heh !  Does that make sense ?

Put another way, I like them both equally, today.

Did I mention, it provides *FREE* unlimited VPN ?   8)

OMG !!!  That does it !

I've already permanently switched to Opera -- Fit For Purpose, and all that stuff, you know ?   :)

I switched a while back, but I'm still discovering features in Opera.  Damn, this browser rawks !

This morning, I wanted to post a podcast link on LinkedIn .  When I searched n' found the podcast page I was looking for, Opera asked me if I wanted to add it to my 'Personal News'.  Hello ?!?!?

I knew this 'Personal News' was baked into Opera, but I never paid any attention to it.  Matter of fact, I disabled the icon in the sidebar.

Anyway, I went to the podcast page and BOOM !  The 'Personal News' screen popped up ....


(http://vindsl.com/images/VinDSL_Selectionshot_2017-08-06_07:33:35.png)


I'll continue to use Guayadeque as the podcatcher, on my desktop machines, but this 'Personal News' feature is going to be great on my portables !

That's it.  Stay thirsty, my friends ...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on August 06, 2017, 12:52:30 pm
Chromium based, so all the same annoyances .. having great feature on top of those annoyances still doesn't cut it for me I'm afraid :(

One day someone'll make the perfect browser, until then FF comes closest for me.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on August 06, 2017, 01:45:43 pm
Chromium based, so all the same annoyances .. having great feature on top of those annoyances still doesn't cut it for me I'm afraid

Fish fight !  ;D

Rosie O'Donnell and Ivanka Trump are based on the same architecture, too.


(http://vindsl.com/images/ivanka_trump_rosie_odonnell.jpg)


There IS a difference ...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on August 06, 2017, 02:03:20 pm
LOL .. I'm not saying they're not different, I'm saying Opera still has the same annoyances that Chrome/Chromium does, bunging some cool features on top doesn't get away from that.

We're back to:-  sh*t off a chrome plated shovel (or a red anodised one that sings) is still sh*t.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on August 06, 2017, 02:21:40 pm
We're back to:-  sh*t off a chrome plated shovel (or a red anodised one that sings) is still sh*t.

Right !

Firefox and Thunderbird are built on the same architecture too, but they appear to be different, to the naked eye.

Supposedly, Opera has a built-in mail client, although I haven't tried it yet.  I'm perfectly happy with the Firefox mail client, once we got the notifications working (https://goo.gl/c4UXaD).

I don't remember reading anything about a built-in mail client in Chromium .  Guess I'll investigate that now.

Maybe they shoehorned Thunderbird into Opera ?!?!  Wouldn't that be a hoot ?   :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on August 06, 2017, 02:57:41 pm
I just can't handle the way any chromium based browser renders some stuff .. it's not an 'Opera' issue, it's a blink issue.

As I said, one day someone will build a perfect browser, but until then FF is the closest for me .. an Opera based on FF would probably come close.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Ly on August 06, 2017, 03:46:45 pm
the only browsers i tried are FireFox,Chrome,Chromium and SlimJet. and i seriously can't see that much of a difference between them all...
The only annoying thing i hate was the chrome crashing in it's older versions but now it's fixed and working well.
Maybe  they have security managing differences i surely don't know about, i mostly visit secure websites anyway.

i'm running P8's default Chromium right now and have nothing to complain about.
i'll give Opera a try though, it seems like a solid browser.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on August 06, 2017, 04:18:53 pm
If someday I have to leave Firefox behind, it will be for PaleMoon...
...or maybe that does not classify as "leaving Firefox" , although I think it does...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: grafiksinc on August 07, 2017, 01:04:51 am
I dunno..... I kind of float between Midori and Chromium .
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: murraymint on August 07, 2017, 12:52:41 pm
The BBC have insisted that everyone now has to register and sign in to listen to their radio online - but only if they're using a UK IP address. The VPN proxy thing in Opera is handy for getting round that.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on August 07, 2017, 02:33:18 pm
Oh sure .. I might install Opera for the odd occasion, but it'll never (in it's current form) be my "go to" browser.
(and there's no way to make ICE support it :()
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on August 07, 2017, 03:15:33 pm
https://forum.peppermintos.com/index.php/topic,903.0.html (https://forum.peppermintos.com/index.php/topic,903.0.html)

A good previous discussion on Alternative browsers, if you're still undecided

Regards Zeb...

thanks for reposting my browser discussion Zeb  8)

I have been only using Chromium in Peppermint 8... haven't yet decided to reinstall the Seamonkey Nightlies yet... which I have used since we went online in '94 when it was called Netscape 3.0 Gold or somesuch... I did download Midori again yesterday, haven't played with it too much. but will later today
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: The PoorGuy on August 08, 2017, 07:49:51 am
.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: N on August 27, 2017, 03:40:58 am
I don't know how I missed Firefox's Pocket integration before, but now that I have noticed it, I don't like it one bit. I looked for ways to remove it but apparently it can only be disabled. Why would Firefox integrate a closed source application that collects a lot of your data without giving users the option to remove it? Seems an odd choice to make — and unpopular if some of the things I read are anything to go by!
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on August 27, 2017, 08:08:08 am
It's easy enough to disable pocket....

In the address bar enter:-
about:config
and hit Enter.

Accept the warning.

In the search bar, search for:-
extensions.pocket.enabled

In the main window, double-click
extensions.pocket.enabled
to toggle it's value to "false"

Done :)



In previous versions of FF you had to first hide the icon from the toolbar, then toggle "browser.pocket.enabled" to false (otherwise it would remain in the "Bookmarks" menu) .. but recent versions of FF remove it all for you if you toggle the newer "extensions.pocket.enabled" key to false.



Instructions for disabling pocket in recent versions of Firefox shown above ⇧⇧⇧

Instructions for disabling pocket in older versions of Firefox can be seen here:
https://www.ghacks.net/2015/05/14/how-to-disable-pocket-in-firefox/



If you also want to disable "Reader View" which is another feature I personally have no use for .. whilst in "about:config", toggle the "reader.parse-on-load.enabled" key to "false".
http://winaero.com/blog/how-to-disable-reader-view-in-firefox/
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: N on August 27, 2017, 09:34:13 am
PCNetSpec, thanks, those are the very instructions I referred to in my post when I said it can be disabled but not removed. It just seems like a weird decision on Mozilla's part.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on August 27, 2017, 12:26:58 pm
Well, at least there's a choice.
Can we say the same about Chrome?
Maybe Pale Moon should be taken more seriously!

Otherwise, IceCat looks like a good option...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on August 27, 2017, 05:06:56 pm
Either way you're still running Firefox .. and usually an old (and possibly insecure) version at that.
(possibly in the same way Google showed Chromium clones were usually less secure than the real thing .. including the ones from the so called 'security' experts like Comodo)
https://bugs.chromium.org/p/project-zero/issues/detail?id=704

Where browsers like SRWare Iron and IceCat state they remove suspect features from and add 'privacy' to Chromium/Firefox, they are usually things you can do yourself in the settings or with extensions .. and they're usually a few releases behind, so missing recent security fixes.
https://www.howtogeek.com/108384/6-alternative-browsers-based-on-google-chrome/

Along with possible security concerns Peppermint couldn't consider a browser (as the supplied default) that doesn't have an active repository for updates, and/or isn't open source, and/or would infringe licensing.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on August 27, 2017, 06:50:11 pm
Thank you for the long explanation, I only use Firefox.
But, since we are at it...
What are your thoughts about Midori?

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Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: N on August 28, 2017, 04:44:18 am
Either way you're still running Firefox .. and usually an old (and possibly insecure) version at that.

This is what occurred to me when I looked at Pale Moon and IceCat, and Seamonkey had far too much stuff in it. Vivaldi and Opera looked promising, but their privacy policies and terms of service didn't reassure me. So Firefox it is!
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on August 28, 2017, 07:33:45 am
Vivaldi and Opera looked promising, but...

Gotta say, I never paid any attention to Vivaldi, until I followed this thread.

Vivaldi appears to be Opera, 'on drugs'.  >:(

I'll stick with Opera - "Just the facts, ma'am.'  Who needs all that cruft ?!?!?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Ly on August 28, 2017, 10:51:11 am
i switched from Firefox/Chromium to Opera some days ago, Like the VPN and Ad block options and the design overall. It also fires up a little bit faster than Firefox. It can also have access to chrome's extensions so it's all good for me  :) .
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: N on August 28, 2017, 12:59:44 pm
I was interested by those features as well, and Vivaldi seemed even more feature rich. Then I read the privacy policies and terms of service for both. Firefox's seemed less invasive to me.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on August 28, 2017, 05:18:45 pm
FFFTW
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on August 29, 2017, 05:21:14 am
Either way you're still running Firefox .. and usually an old (and possibly insecure) version at that.
(possibly in the same way Google showed Chromium clones were usually less secure than the real thing .. including the ones from the so called 'security' experts like Comodo)
https://bugs.chromium.org/p/project-zero/issues/detail?id=704

Where browsers like SRWare Iron and IceCat state they remove suspect features from and add 'privacy' to Chromium/Firefox, they are usually things you can do yourself in the settings or with extensions .. and they're usually a few releases behind, so missing recent security fixes.
https://www.howtogeek.com/108384/6-alternative-browsers-based-on-google-chrome/

Along with possible security concerns Peppermint couldn't consider a browser (as the supplied default) that doesn't have an active repository for updates, and/or isn't open source, and/or would infringe licensing.

Sorry, if I'm a bit annoying coming back to this. As you already know I use Firefox and I'm happy with that. On my mobile I use Firefox Focus (this is much "smaller" than FF, which makes sense on a mobile)

As I can read from Pale Moon forum there's this statement from the Lead Developer...
"Every Firefox release cycle, I contact the Mozilla Security team to get bug access for otherwise locked sec bugs. This allows me to audit these vulnerabilities, assess applicability, and port across what applies to our code base. Our security is at all times at least at the release edge of the equivalent published Firefox version, and in some cases beyond it.
If you think Pale Moon 27 is "rebranded Firefox 38.0" then you should stop and read up a little on what Pale Moon is before saying anything more."

But, most interesting is...
"I have absolutely no intention to cave in to peer pressure, if it were ever applied. Pale Moon will not be a place to collect data and will not be burdened by in-program aggregators or similar. Quite the opposite: a lot of data collection code has been removed already, and we're continuing to do so.
We have no interest in your data or content. It's yours and yours alone.
This policy also extends to our servers: We don't log more than what is needed for normal operational procedures, and we generally also don't retain this data longer than necessary. This is why we e.g. don't have ready statistics for the number of Pale Moon users - we don't collect that data.
As an aside: Working on removing telemetry code from the core actually brought to light just to what excruciating detail Mozilla collects data through their telemetry. It's a real mountain - more data than I can really understand a company like that would ever need to collect from their browser users to improve their product. It looks very much like OCD, to be honest. I can only assume Microsoft is doing the same to a similar level."

It doesn't seem to me to be an old version of Firefox. Just a version where invasive tools are actively been removed from the upstream.

Now, it does contain proprietary tools but,
"The profile migration tool, web installer stub, and some other helper applications are released under a different freeware license. These tools are not part of the browser and do not need to be Open Source. You also in no way need these tools to be able to fully use the browser in all its facets. There is no requirement or even reason why I should be forced to also release helper applications that are in no way tied to browser operation as Open Source as well."

Suck  :-\

It would just feel so much better to have a good third alternative...

Tor anyone?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: N on August 29, 2017, 10:44:51 am
That's interesting, pin, thanks for sharing. Could you post a link as well? I'm curious to read the thread these quotes are from.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on August 29, 2017, 01:18:21 pm
Sure N, here you go:
Security issues in Palemoon?, https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?t=14610

About telemetry, https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=9033&start=20#p61077

About the non-open source tools, https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?t=15018

Good read!
The nice thing about pale moon is that it looks and works just like firefox, so I feel at home  :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: N on August 30, 2017, 03:43:20 am
Thanks for sharing those links, pin. I chose Firefox hoping for better privacy but this puts me in some doubt.

Here is something I found about disabling telemetry options in Firefox (haven't tried this myself yet):
https://superuser.com/questions/1003201/how-do-i-stop-mozilla-telemetry/1003208

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on August 30, 2017, 09:13:49 am
Thanks N. Looks like a very simple thing to do. I will probably test it and see if it has any impact on other things. Namely, netflix that requires DRL content to be activated, as well as browser history. The first one makes sense, but why does it require the second one, beats me ??

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Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: acer on August 30, 2017, 05:16:18 pm
my browser of choice has been FF and FF ESR since the phoenix days  mainly for extensions and tweaking/ configuration ease.
When browser-hopping, I always end up back at the familiar comfort zone, bit like peppermint when distro-hopping  ;)

Has anyone tried the new updated Yandex browser yet?
Here is what I've recently read about it:

Quote
Yandex Browser 17.7.1.791

Yandex Browser is another Chrome based browser featuring a fast minimalist interface with unique features like Stealth Mode.

It takes Chrome up a notch starting with its “Tile” looking home page and a background of your choice, including animated wallpapers, making this a familiar look to Windows 10 users. Yandex calls this “Tableau.” Yeah, we had to look it up. I think the best fit is “a graphic description or representation.” Those who prefer a minimalist appearance can restart from settings and load it without the background photos, etc. See the last screenshot for how that looks. It is also capable of warning you of dangerous sites and uses Kaspersky for download scanning.

One really nice feature is Stealth Mode; it permits you to block cookies, tracking devices and effectively hide your IP. You can also get extensions, manage your downloads and even sync across devices. You have access to numerous language translations.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on August 30, 2017, 09:15:43 pm
Sure N, here you go:
Security issues in Palemoon?, https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?t=14610

About telemetry, https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=9033&start=20#p61077

About the non-open source tools, https://forum.palemoon.org/viewtopic.php?t=15018

Good read!
The nice thing about pale moon is that it looks and works just like firefox, so I feel at home  :)

greatly appreciate your clarification pin... answering from palemoon now...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: N on August 31, 2017, 02:47:59 am
I will probably test it and see if it has any impact on other things.

If you try this, please share how it goes!
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on August 31, 2017, 06:44:49 am
@spence
Hope you enjoy palemoon. I like it a lot.
@N
Will report back but, don't know when I have time to do it.

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Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on August 31, 2017, 07:26:28 pm
@spence
Hope you enjoy palemoon. I like it a lot.

As stated previously, my entry onto the www was with Netscape Navigator 3.0 Gold... so I am quite fond of all things Mozilla... or perhaps better stated I have fond memories of the Netscape era... Modern Mozilla has put me off... II dislike some of their habits and their corporate slide into near irrelevance....

So adding a forked project from the original netscape gecko code base feels like coming home to me... happy to have Palemoon and Seamonkey back in play... 
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on September 01, 2017, 04:20:04 am
@spence
You beat me... :'(
My debut was on Netscape 4  :o

EDIT: Now running Pale Moon also on Peppermint 7
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: anselm on September 01, 2017, 03:58:58 pm
My first "graphical" browser was Mosaic. Around the early 90's, before that it was all text.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: N on September 04, 2017, 09:10:54 am
I came across Waterfox yesterday, has anyone here used it? Its latest is the same version number as the latest Firefox, and it claims to have telemetry and data collection removed, along with a few other privacy-friendly additions/ removals.

https://www.waterfoxproject.org/
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on September 04, 2017, 12:27:54 pm
Hi N!

Never tried Waterfox
Although, my main PC runs Peppermint, I also like to use Void. You learn a lot with it, rolling release and very small community.
I remember that Void has refused to host Waterfox, see:
https://github.com/voidlinux/void-packages/pull/7418

On the other hand they have also refused to host Pale Moon

EDIT: Although, in the case of Pale Moon, I got the feeling it had to do with the non-open source tools.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on September 10, 2017, 12:46:25 pm
OPERA UPDATE

I'm still happy as a lark with Opera, but I thought I should mention a caveat when using their free, unlimited VPN feature, day after day - 28.1 GB this month, so far.

Google (and their cohorts) are thoroughly confused. Their best guess is, I'm located in the Ukraine and speak Russian.

That's fine and dandy, until I try to buy something online. Some sites - no problem. But, any place that adds Google to the mix, such as their robot captcha, freaks out. Facebook, as an example, totally freaked out when logging in with VPN enabled  - took me weeks to recover my account. They would show baby pictures on my 400+ 'friends' accounts, and ask me to identify them. LoL! I finally did it, through sheer will and determination.

So, VPN is a double edged sword. Caveat emptor.

I've started using Chromium again, with appropriate extensions (Ghostery, uBlock Origin, ScriptSafe, et cetera) when ordering things online. Enough info leaks through that my accounts aren't flagged. And, I use Opera (with VPN enabled) for everything else.

Just saying...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: N on September 10, 2017, 01:55:35 pm
Either way you're still running Firefox .. and usually an old (and possibly insecure) version at that.

This is what occurred to me when I looked at Pale Moon and IceCat, and Seamonkey had far too much stuff in it. Vivaldi and Opera looked promising, but their privacy policies and terms of service didn't reassure me. So Firefox it is!

Having used Firefox for several days in a row, I've noticed some issues that don't occur with Chromium. I use the same security/ privacy extensions on both, but on Firefox these interfere unpredictably with streaming music playback while Chromium can be relied on to stream correctly every time.

P.S.: This is not my first time using Firefox, but I did not previously have much set up by way of security and privacy. Ditto for Chromium (Chrome to be exact).
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on September 10, 2017, 02:02:18 pm
Which extensions ?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: N on September 10, 2017, 02:50:38 pm
Which extensions ?

Privacy Badger (on both browsers)
HTTPS Everywhere (on both browsers)
uBlock Origin (on both browsers)
uBlock Origin Extra (on Chromium only)
Disconnect (on both browsers)
Disconnect Search (on Chromium only)
Decentraleyes (on both browsers)
NoScript (on Firefox only, but disabled/ removed for the purposes of troubleshooting)

I've tried using Firefox's restore option to figure out what interferes with playback, but after a certain point the results aren't consistent. Sometimes enabling/ disabling the same thing stops playback, at other times it doesn't. Probably need to go over the steps again.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on September 10, 2017, 03:30:21 pm
Can you give us an example of a site where audio playback doesn't work in Firefox ?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Ly on September 10, 2017, 06:45:13 pm
I came across Waterfox yesterday, has anyone here used it? Its latest is the same version number as the latest Firefox, and it claims to have telemetry and data collection removed, along with a few other privacy-friendly additions/ removals.

https://www.waterfoxproject.org/

anyone tested it ? seems to be a better version of firefox.
I'm still using Opera, i don't use the VPN feature. I do use the AD Block one and it seems working just fine.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on October 19, 2017, 07:54:47 am
Just got this link from the Void linux forum...

https://gist.github.com/haasn/69e19fc2fe0e25f3cff5

...a lot of good tips to make FF less invasive!

Will test in Void first  ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on October 19, 2017, 09:14:02 am
Nice find :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: grafiksinc on October 19, 2017, 10:26:45 am
Speaking of Opera, OperaSoftware was bought out last year:
https://phys.org/news/2016-07-chinese-consortium-opera-browser-mn.html (https://phys.org/news/2016-07-chinese-consortium-opera-browser-mn.html)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on October 19, 2017, 11:42:39 am
I'm still using Opera, i don't use the VPN feature. I do use the AD Block one and it seems working just fine.

The new, built-in Opera 'Snapshot' feature works a treat, too. Click, crop, capture to a file or copy to clipboard. Bada bing, bada boom.

I use this feature, all the time on LinkedIn - saves me hella steps.  8)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on October 19, 2017, 04:43:09 pm
Ok! I've tested/enabled all those options (https://gist.github.com/haasn/69e19fc2fe0e25f3cff5) in FF on Void linux and..., so far no issues ! That said, if you must have Netflix, you have to enable DRL content AND browser history ...
Could not really test this in Void, cause I'm running Void based on musl libC (https://www.musl-libc.org/) and not on glib C. Actually, that's one of the reasons why I'm running Void ! Musl doesn't work well with any proprietary apps, sorry
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on November 19, 2017, 01:02:54 pm
Just got this link from the Void linux forum...

https://gist.github.com/haasn/69e19fc2fe0e25f3cff5

...a lot of good tips to make FF less invasive!

Will test in Void first  ;)

Props & thanks... just wondering though, a good number of these have no mention in Seamonkey 2.49.1... would one want to create them? or just be glad they aren't already part of about:config?  :-\

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on November 19, 2017, 03:20:12 pm
Hi spence,
Some of those were not in FF either, there have been changes to the browser and they are not up-to-date. I think you should be happy that they are not there!

Seamonkey? What happen to Pale Moon?
I had to remove Pale Moon myself, Netflix stopped working when I had it installed
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 19, 2017, 07:31:53 pm
In my experience Opera has worked best with Peppermint on my machines.  I like Vivaldi but have found it to be a bit slow.  Iridium is fast but I'm not sold on its security.  YMMV, however.   ;)

Hi mac,

How I wish this were true for me since I really like Noway's privacy laws.  But, again and again, I have sizing problems with Opera on my laptop, and, unfortunately, I've found Opera's forum to be deaf to the concerns of its users.  Vivaldi, on the other hand, seems somewhat cumbersome, but I don't know what to make of it yet.  I did spot one of Opera's old trolls roaming Vivaldi's forum.  Whether or not he's kept in check there, or is on good behavior, I don't know.  Also, I don't know how Vivaldi is concerning privacy. :-\

Another interesting Chromium-based browser is Yandex browser, but with geo-politics being the way it is right now, I don't know what to say other than the last time I used Yandex browser it ran splendidly.  The only thing I missed when running Yandex browser was the security color of green when security is at its tightest.  That, I missed.  But, even when living without a home button, Yandex browser ran very, very well, and it even includes DNSCrypt! ;)

perknh

P.S.

How even Yandex is being brought under control

 By Yegor Osipov-Gipsh (https://raamoprusland.nl/auteurs/80) for RaamopRusland (https://raamoprusland.nl/mission-statement-window-to-russia/188-mission-statement-window-to-russia)

https://raamoprusland.nl/dossiers/economie/786-how-even-yandex-is-being-brought-under-control
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 19, 2017, 08:43:51 pm
But, again and again, I have sizing problems with Opera on my laptop, and, unfortunately, I've found Opera's forum to be deaf to the concerns of its users.

If you're talking about the startup size, here's the haxor I use on the launcher command (panel launcher shown):


(http://vindsl.com/images/Windowshot_2017-11-19_18:27:38.png)


I know those are odd dimensions, but it allows for 2 Opera windows positioned perfectly, side-by-side, on my 29" Dell monitor - essentially 2 x 19" screens on 1 monitor.

If you're talking about the web page sizes on various sites, you can set the zoom level ( + or - ) in the drop-down Opera Menu, and it will remember the zoom levels between sessions.


Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 19, 2017, 08:57:35 pm

If you're talking about the startup size, here's the haxor I use on the launcher command (panel launcher shown):

I know those are odd dimensions, but it allows for 2 Opera windows positioned perfectly, side-by-side, on my 29" Dell monitor - essentially 2 x 19" screens on 1 monitor.

If you're talking about the web page sizes on various sites, you can set the zoom level ( + or - ) in the drop-down Opera Menu, and it will remember the zoom levels between sessions.

Hi VinDSL,

How would I get that edit launcher?  That's the tool I need to have.  PCNetSpec found the numbers I need for this last April. ;)

Thank you,

perknh
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 19, 2017, 09:48:07 pm
How would I get that edit launcher?  That's the tool I need to have.  PCNetSpec found the numbers I need for this last April. ;)

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 19, 2017, 09:58:24 pm
BTW, if you haven't already added the Opera icon to your panel...

Go to the 'internet' category in Peppermint's main menu, right-click 'Opera', then 'Add to Panel'.

You can change Opera, in the main menu too, but it requires a lot of nonsense - and you'll jack things up, if you aren't careful.

It's much easier editing selections in the panel.   ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 19, 2017, 11:53:05 pm
It's much easier editing selections in the panel.   ;)

It sure is, VinDSL!  That was exactly what I needed.  Believe it or not, I never modified a launcher in the panel before, but with the help of PCNetSpec's numbers from last April, and your instructions tonight, Opera-beta is now sizing itself correctly for me. :)

Thank you, VinDSL.  I'm certain this thread is going to help a lot of people who are wrestling with sizing issues in Opera.

perknh.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on November 20, 2017, 01:27:44 am
@perknh
You wrote: 'I really like Norway's privacy laws'. I guess you are aware that Opera was bought by a Chinease consortium 16 months ago? See, https://www.engadget.com/2016/07/18/opera-browser-sold-to-a-chinese-consortium-for-600-million/
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 20, 2017, 02:08:38 am
I used to hate Opera. It wasn't until Opera 12 that I could stomach using it, on a semi-regular basis.

When they decided to go down the Chromium road, I was shocked at how bad their rendition was. I thought that was the swan song for Opera.

When I tried it again, a few months ago, I was shocked how good it had become. At that time, I didn't realize the commies had invaded the Opera House.

Now, Opera is all I use, and it's getting better every day - no kidding. They're moving at a lightening pace.

Really, the Chinese buying them was the best thing that ever happened to Opera...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on November 20, 2017, 05:44:30 am
Good to know, thanks!
Never said Opera was bad, actually to be honest never used it. But, it's hardy from Norway

Skickat från min SM-G900F via Tapatalk

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 20, 2017, 07:47:11 am
I've colored and highlighted below some of what I like, dislike, and question from Opera's May 6, 2016 privacy statement.   Fortunately, unlike Google's labyrinthine privacy policy, you don't have to be a lawyer to understand it.  So that's the very first thing I like about Opera's privacy statement --its simplicity! ;)

Here's I've colored and highlighted what I like about Opera's privacy statement. :)

Quote
How do we protect your data?

We treat your personal data as required by law. We are a Norwegian company and we follow Norwegian data-security laws as well as other national legislation, as needed. We require that our suppliers successfully pass security assessments and prove their compliance with applicable laws and industry standards.

Only a limited number of Opera employees have access to the data we collect. We review and update our working procedures regularly to improve your privacy and ensure that our internal policies are followed. We immediately correct any non-conformance regarding these policies.

Here I've colored and highlighted what I'm not too crazy about. :(

Quote
How do we share your data?

We may share your data:

To government bodies and law enforcement agencies to comply with the law, for example in judicial proceedings, by court order or other legal process
To third parties (including professional advisors) to enforce or defend our legal rights, including our terms and conditions
To a third-party purchaser or seller (including professional advisors) in connection with a corporate event such as a merger, business acquisition or insolvency situation
As described elsewhere in this statement

And, here, I've highlighted and colored blue what I wonder about. :-\

Quote
We retain personal data only as long as necessary for processing it in accordance with the purposes described in this statement, or as otherwise necessary to comply with applicable laws. When your data is no longer necessary or relevant for our purposes, or required by applicable laws, we take steps to have it deleted, aggregated or made anonymous.

Source:  https://www.opera.com/privacy
 
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on November 20, 2017, 11:14:10 am
Hi spence,
Some of those were not in FF either, there have been changes to the browser and they are not up-to-date. I think you should be happy that they are not there!

I began creating some of them, then wondered why I was doing that...

Seamonkey? What happen to Pale Moon?
I had to remove Pale Moon myself, Netflix stopped working when I had it installed

I'm still attached to having a single spot to check all of my e'mail addresses, I'm not fond of spending time logging into multiple webmail clients... Palemoon is still installed for it handles browsing better at the moment than Seamonkey does... Still have Chromium too...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 20, 2017, 12:16:12 pm
I've colored and highlighted below some of what I like, dislike, and question from Opera's May 6, 2016 privacy statement.   Fortunately, unlike Google's labyrinthine privacy policy, you don't have to be a lawyer to understand it.  So that's the very first thing I like about Opera's privacy statement --its simplicity! ;)

SOURCE:  https://www.opera.com/privacy

That (and most else on that website) pertains to Opera 12.0, not... let's see where it stands now... Opera 51.xxx


Quote
Opera has sold most of itself to a Chinese consortium for $600 million. The buyers, led by search and security firm Qihoo 360, are purchasing Opera's browser business, its privacy and performance apps, its tech licensing and, most importantly, its name.

Source: (pin's link, above)

Here's Qihoo 360's Wikipedia page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qihoo_360

If it gives you any solace, it's a Chinese internet security company (http://www.360totalsecurity.com/). I highly doubt they're going to put their 600 million USD investment in jeopardy, and soil their security reputation by haxoring Opera browser users...   ;)


EDIT


BTW, if one is foolish enough to use Chromium/Chrome extensions in Opera, all security and privacy bets are off.

It's not Opera's fault if their users let the fox in the henhouse, right? And, yes, I'm one of those foolish ones...   :D
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 20, 2017, 02:16:51 pm
That (and most else on that website) pertains to Opera 12.0, not... let's see where it stands now... Opera 51.xxx
...

BTW, if one is foolish enough to use Chromium/Chrome extensions in Opera, all security and privacy bets are off.

It's not Opera's fault if their users let the fox in the henhouse, right? And, yes, I'm one of those foolish ones...   :D

Hi VinDSL,

I don't know it this really matters, but I found Opera's privacy policy through my installation of Opera 50's About Opera link.

And, me too with the extensions.  I'm running open source ScriptSafe, and Free and Open Source Privacy Badger.  Since I can't read code, I hope they're okay.  Needless to say, I've white-listed Peppermint's forum in Privacy Badger.  ;) 

perknh
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 20, 2017, 03:06:14 pm
And, me too with the extensions.  I'm running open source ScriptSafe, and Free and Open Source Privacy Badger.  Since I can't read code, I hope they're okay.  Needless to say, I've white-listed Peppermint's forum in Privacy Badger.  ;)

Up to you, my man.  :)

Opera has a built-in 'ad blocker' - after all, the new owner is an Internet security company. I've been using it with everything enabled.

Seems to be working great, with the least amount of hassles of any combination I've cooked up. One can add custom lists too, if desired.


(http://vindsl.com/images/VinDSL_Selectionshot_2017-11-20_12:55:45.png)


'EasyList' and 'EasyPrivacy' are the safest way to go. See the proviso at the bottom of the 'Block Ads - Manage Lists' window.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 20, 2017, 06:15:05 pm
That looks good, VinDSL.  I forgot to mention I'm running HTTPS Everywhere too --even though I don't know if doing so is so important any longer. :-\
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: scifidude79 on November 20, 2017, 10:21:26 pm
Can you disable the Opera ad blocker for certain sites?  You know, like this one for example that rely on ad revenue.  That's one thing I like about ad blocker plugins, you can choose to have them not activated on some sites but activated on others.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 21, 2017, 01:00:02 am
Can you disable the Opera ad blocker for certain sites?  You know, like this one for example that rely on ad revenue.  That's one thing I like about ad blocker plugins, you can choose to have them not activated on some sites but activated on others.

Hi scifidude79.  Yes, you can! :)

(https://i.imgur.com/EjkrLQM.png)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: scifidude79 on November 21, 2017, 10:01:34 pm
Hi scifidude79.  Yes, you can! :)

Cool.  Thanks for the info.  :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: LNXlady on November 22, 2017, 09:34:56 am
Has anyone else tried Brave? I wanted to like it but it has the same little annoyances for me that Chrome does so I was back on Firefox within a couple of hours. I also noticed that the header of a frequently used site didn't render correctly so that put me off. I keep Vivaldi around for when I want to post to Instagram from my computer (I keep it in the sidebar) or when I need to Chromecast something but just can't use it as a day to day browser.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 22, 2017, 09:42:24 am
Has anyone else tried Brave? I wanted to like it but it has the same little annoyances[...]

It's installed on my test box. I don't use Brave, other than keeping tabs on the 'competition'.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on November 22, 2017, 10:52:21 am
Finally, something new and interesting...
All these forks of chromium/chrome/brave/...
Until today I had Pale Moon as the only alternative to Firefox. Tried IceCat, but was slugish and slow. I haven't tried this one yet, but sounds interesting...
http://www.basilisk-browser.org/

Most probably the future Pale Moon
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 22, 2017, 11:48:18 am
Are they making a "feature" out of it still supporting NPAPI plugins :o

Even though it's only a result of basing on an old version of Firefox (not something they added), I'd have thought they'd have at least not mentioned it, if not actively hidden it ;)

So less sandboxed than Firefox and support for insecure legacy addons are now selling points ?

Sometimes I feel totally out of step with the rest of humanity :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 22, 2017, 12:01:59 pm
Sometimes I feel totally out of step with the rest of humanity :)

#MeToo

When I'm in public, I often feel like the only normal person in the room.

Basically, I love humanity, but I hate people...  8)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 22, 2017, 12:07:48 pm
Yo bruv :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on November 22, 2017, 01:03:15 pm
What’s 'normal'? And, is it good to be 'normal'?
I didn't had the time to read about the browser itself. Just thought it was interesting 'cause it seems like 9 out of 10 new browsers are forks of chromium. Good with something different for a change!
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 22, 2017, 02:19:28 pm
What’s 'normal'?

My definition is, if you have to ask... you aren't. LoL!  :D
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on November 22, 2017, 02:34:28 pm
I was beginning to get worried
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: LNXlady on November 22, 2017, 05:38:42 pm
What’s 'normal'? And, is it good to be 'normal'?
I didn't had the time to read about the browser itself. Just thought it was interesting 'cause it seems like 9 out of 10 new browsers are forks of chromium. Good with something different for a change!

This may not be the best place to ask that question. Just sayin'...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 22, 2017, 10:23:32 pm
What’s 'normal'? And, is it good to be 'normal'?
I didn't had the time to read about the browser itself. Just thought it was interesting 'cause it seems like 9 out of 10 new browsers are forks of chromium. Good with something different for a change!

This may not be the best place to ask that question. Just sayin'...

Bwahahaha :))
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 23, 2017, 06:15:13 am
Here's the best pitch I've read yet for Vivaldi.  I only wish Vivaldi wasn't such a woolly monster:  configuring Vivaldi can take a lot of time.

Web browser inventor calls for action on data collection by tech giants

By Charlie Taylor for the Irish Times.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/technology/web-browser-inventor-calls-for-action-on-data-collection-by-tech-giants-1.3300990

And, on the other hand, we're really not paranoid we were concerned about needless data collection.  Even our keystrokes are collected on some sites we visit and use. :o  But, I don't see how a browser can protect us against this type of data collection.

More than 480 web firms record 'every keystroke'

By Jane Wakefield for BBC News.

http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-42065650


Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 29, 2017, 07:51:21 am
To the Peppermint's Opera browser users:

After years and years of running Opera, it recently dawned on me that Opera never got around to including a built-in translator into its browser.  I wonder why Opera isn't using the built-in translator that's included in Chromium browser.  Since Opera is built off of Chromium browser, wouldn't that be the simplest way to include this essential, oft-needed tool?  Or could there be a licensing problem when taking the translator from an open source project and moving it to a proprietary one? :-\

Anyway, the point being, IMO not having a built-in translator is serious omission on Opera's part. :(
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: murraymint on November 29, 2017, 08:42:44 am
Probably because it's Google translate? I'm sure you can just install an extension yourself.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 29, 2017, 11:05:37 am
To the Peppermint's Opera browser users:

After years and years of running Opera, it recently dawned on me that Opera never got around to including a built-in translator into its browser.  I wonder why Opera isn't using the built-in translator that's included in Chromium browser.  Since Opera is built off of Chromium browser, wouldn't that be the simplest way to include this essential, oft-needed tool?  Or could there be a licensing problem when taking the translator from an open source project and moving it to a proprietary one? :-\

Anyway, the point being, IMO not having a built-in translator is serious omission on Opera's part. :(

Official Opera Translator Add-on (works for me): https://goo.gl/KHKz3Q

If that doesn't float your boat (haven't tried them yet): https://goo.gl/bexvKR
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 29, 2017, 11:08:17 am
Probably because it's Google translate? I'm sure you can just install an extension yourself.

Hello murraymint,

Yes, it is.  When you're working with a page that's not in your browser's default language, it asks you if you'd like to translate the page.  It's a terrific feature.  But in order to have Google Translate in Opera, you first need to install the Download Chrome Extension within Opera in order to go to the Chrome Web Store to install Google Translate.  It's all a grand PITA --especially when you know that the translator had been originally included within Chromium browser by default before it was purposely removed. ::)

Hi VinDSL.  I saw that but I had no idea who sailormax was.  Maybe Opera's translator is a modified Google Translator.  I wonder, too, about the permissions, but I suppose you have to have them in order to translate a page.

Thank you, both.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 29, 2017, 02:40:00 pm
Being owned by an Internet security company, Opera is pretty picky about their official add-ons.

With unofficial Chrome(ium) add-ons, which you can use if you wish, you're on your own.  ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 29, 2017, 04:14:29 pm
Being owned by an Internet security company, Opera is pretty picky about their official add-ons.

With unofficial Chrome(ium) add-ons, which you can use if you wish, you're on your own.  ;)

That's interesting.  You're saying, if I understand you correctly, is that in this case, even though the Google Translate extension is officially from Google, I'd be better off using Opera's translator from sailormax because it's directly from Opera add-ons.

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: gdemaroney@yahoo.com on November 29, 2017, 11:08:45 pm
I found Pale Moon the best on Peppermint. Tried Chromium and Firefox but very Happy with Pale Moon. Sooooo Far and the longest use of any of the others.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on December 20, 2017, 05:29:57 pm
A few more compelling augments for pushing a little more away from Google --which is something I find easier said than done ::)

Google asks browser rival Vivaldi to post uninstall instructions

By Andrew Orlowski for The Register

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/12/18/google_d_vivaldi_adwords/
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on December 20, 2017, 06:29:25 pm
w3m anyone?
Had it for a few days but, how secure is it?
luakit?
Still on lua 5.1... Should be on lua 5.3!!
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on December 20, 2017, 07:06:26 pm
The latest source code for w3m is from 2011 .. draw whatever conclusions you want from that.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: scifidude79 on December 21, 2017, 10:06:13 am
The latest source code for w3m is from 2011 .. draw whatever conclusions you want from that.

There's nothing bad about that, it's perfectly safe.  :P
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on December 21, 2017, 10:14:09 am
@scifidude79
Are you running w3m? I found it quite nice, if I just want to read a paper. No distraction,  just text

Otherwise, FF is still my main browser
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: scifidude79 on December 21, 2017, 11:47:37 am
No, I run Firefox.  I don't dabble in other browsers.  I'm not home long enough on days that I work and usually do other stuff on my days off.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: tinkereR on December 21, 2017, 11:03:27 pm
I've been using Pale Moon for the past 4-5 years. Probably the only person shy of 20 years old to be using this browser  ;) Firefox is far from terrible, but it's hardly Firefox anymore. It's reminiscent of the Opera days during the controversial switch from Presto to Blink. Basilisk isn't a bad option either.
I use Chromium for ICE wrappers, with the exception of Amazon Prime Video since Chromium can't decrypt DRM content. (I don't like Chrome)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on December 22, 2017, 06:43:57 am
Personally I love the new FF .. there are small bugs such as it not always offering a right-click context menu when clicking on highlighted text but I expect those will be fixed soon enough (and for now you can still Ctrl+C) .. but I'm loving the speed :)

I'm a L-O-N-G time Firefox user so thought I'd have a problem when 57 was released, but no I'm happy as Larry (whoever he is).
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Ly on December 22, 2017, 06:52:20 am
For some reason, Opera runs very slow on my laptop and i switched to chromium a moth ago. Now with the new Firefox Quantum i don't know which is less memory consuming, Firefox or Chromium?
I've also wanted to give WaterFox a try but couldn't find an easy way to install/update it (apt-get...).
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on December 22, 2017, 07:37:54 am
For some reason, Opera runs very slow on my laptop and i switched to chromium a moth ago.

I know what you mean, Ly.  Opera does not run fast on my neighbor's old Dell Dimension computer either.  On the other hand, Firefox works well, and is quite peppy, on that well-built, legacy computer.  :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on December 22, 2017, 07:52:32 am
@Ly
You could download the tarball from the waterfox site and run
Code: [Select]
tar -xvf ./waterfox-56.0.1.en-US.linux-x86_64.tar.bz2
Code: [Select]
cd ./waterfox
Code: [Select]
./waterfox

Or if you trust PPA's have a look at https://github.com/hawkeye116477/waterfox-deb/blob/master/README.md

Obs: Not tested myself
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Ly on December 22, 2017, 05:21:11 pm
For some reason, Opera runs very slow on my laptop and i switched to chromium a moth ago.

I know what you mean, Ly.  Opera does not run fast on my neighbor's old Dell Dimension computer either.  On the other hand, Firefox works well, and is quite peppy, on that well-built, legacy computer.  :)
Opera was doing fine when i first installed it, then for some reason i don't understand it started to run very slow, at the beginning only opera website and extensions websites were concerned, then i noticed it used to run faster than it did at the first time so i decided to move to chromium and i have Firefox as a backup Browser.
@Ly
You could download the tarball from the waterfox site and run
Code: [Select]
tar -xvf ./waterfox-56.0.1.en-US.linux-x86_64.tar.bz2
Code: [Select]
cd ./waterfox
Code: [Select]
./waterfox

Or if you trust PPA's have a look at https://github.com/hawkeye116477/waterfox-deb/blob/master/README.md

Obs: Not tested myself
Thanks pin, i'll try the first solution :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on December 22, 2017, 05:52:59 pm
Opera was doing fine when i first installed it, then for some reason i don't understand it started to run very slow.

Don't know if you were running the Opera VPN, but it's FUBAR right now. Turn off the free VPN , and it runs fine.

The VPN is knocking my speed down to 40K-100K. Basically, the VPN feature useless, unless one is used to running at 56-Gay dialup speeds.

At least that's been my experience ...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on December 25, 2017, 09:18:49 am
Merry Christmas, everyone.  I discovered a new trick here if anyone wants to make Opera always open in private browsing mode.  Just modify the launcher command by adding --private after the window size.

Code: [Select]
Example:

opera-beta  --window-size=1600,850 --private %U

Now Opera will always open for you in incognito mode! ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on December 28, 2017, 07:46:50 pm
Personally I love the new FF .. there are small bugs such as it not always offering a right-click context menu when clicking on highlighted text but I expect those will be fixed soon enough (and for now you can still Ctrl+C) .. but I'm loving the speed :)

I'm a L-O-N-G time Firefox user so thought I'd have a problem when 57 was released, but no I'm happy as Larry (whoever he is).

Hey, I'm impressed with the new Firefox too...and it FINALLY has the ScriptSafe extension in Add-ons for Firefox too!  For some reason, I could only install it when using the dark theme --but it's working! :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Ly on December 29, 2017, 04:08:32 am
Opera was doing fine when i first installed it, then for some reason i don't understand it started to run very slow.

Don't know if you were running the Opera VPN, but it's FUBAR right now. Turn off the free VPN , and it runs fine.

The VPN is knocking my speed down to 40K-100K. Basically, the VPN feature useless, unless one is used to running at 56-Gay dialup speeds.

At least that's been my experience ...

i didn't run any vpn, it was basically a momentary "lag" of Opera which i can't really explain. I tried reinstalling it yesterday and it seems running just fine.
The only problem i got right now is that it doesn't show the "reduce" and "close" window button unless it's not enlarged which is problematic...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on December 29, 2017, 08:49:14 am
i didn't run any vpn, it was basically a momentary "lag" of Opera which i can't really explain. I tried reinstalling it yesterday and it seems running just fine.
The only problem i got right now is that it doesn't show the "reduce" and "close" window button unless it's not enlarged which is problematic...

Hello Ly,

VinDSL set me straight on this one.  That link can be found here (https://forum.peppermintos.com/index.php/topic,5383.msg62974.html#msg62974).  You've got to play with the numbers a little in order to see what works best for your browser

In my case, I took my inxi -Fz numbers (found under graphics), and subtracted 50 from the 900.  So, in my case, my computer's Resolution: 1600x900@60.01hz becomes opera-beta  --window-size=1600,850 %U in Peppermint's menu and panel launchers.


Spoiler (click here to view / hide)
perknh@peppermint ~ $ inxi -Fz
System:    Host: peppermint Kernel: 4.10.0-42-generic x86_64 (64 bit) Desktop: N/A
           Distro: Peppermint Eight
Machine:   System: TOSHIBA product: Satellite C70-A v: PSCE2U-03E00S
           Mobo: Type2 - Board Vendor Name1 model: Type2 - Board Product Name1 v: Type2 - Board Version
           Bios: Insyde v: 1.30 date: 04/18/2014
CPU:       Dual core Intel Pentium 2020M (-MCP-) cache: 2048 KB
           clock speeds: max: 2400 MHz 1: 1409 MHz 2: 1598 MHz
Graphics:  Card: Intel 3rd Gen Core processor Graphics Controller
           Display Server: X.Org 1.19.3 drivers: (unloaded: fbdev,vesa)
           Resolution: 1600x900@60.01hz
           GLX Renderer: Mesa DRI Intel Ivybridge Mobile
           GLX Version: 3.0 Mesa 17.0.2
Audio:     Card Intel 7 Series/C210 Series Family High Definition Audio Controller
           driver: snd_hda_intel
           Sound: Advanced Linux Sound Architecture v: k4.10.0-42-generic
Network:   Card-1: Realtek RTL8188EE Wireless Network Adapter driver: rtl8188ee
           IF: wlp2s0 state: down mac: <filter>
           Card-2: Qualcomm Atheros AR8162 Fast Ethernet driver: alx
           IF: enp3s0 state: up speed: 100 Mbps duplex: full mac: <filter>
Drives:    HDD Total Size: 240.1GB (5.1% used)
           ID-1: /dev/sda model: PNY_CS1311_240GB size: 240.1GB
Partition: ID-1: / size: 95G used: 5.9G (7%) fs: ext4 dev: /dev/sda6
           ID-2: swap-1 size: 6.33GB used: 0.00GB (0%) fs: swap dev: /dev/sda5
RAID:      No RAID devices: /proc/mdstat, md_mod kernel module present
Sensors:   System Temperatures: cpu: 50.0C mobo: N/A
           Fan Speeds (in rpm): cpu: N/A
Info:      Processes: 173 Uptime: 3:37 Memory: 1693.4/5859.9MB
           Client: Shell (bash) inxi: 2.2.35
perknh@peppermint ~ $
[close]

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Ly on December 29, 2017, 03:43:57 pm
i didn't run any vpn, it was basically a momentary "lag" of Opera which i can't really explain. I tried reinstalling it yesterday and it seems running just fine.
The only problem i got right now is that it doesn't show the "reduce" and "close" window button unless it's not enlarged which is problematic...

Hello Ly,

VinDSL set me straight on this one.  That link can be found here (https://forum.peppermintos.com/index.php/topic,5383.msg62974.html#msg62974).  You've got to play with the numbers a little in order to see what works best for your browser

In my case, I took my inxi -Fz numbers (found under graphics), and subtracted 50 from the 900.  So, in my case, my computer's Resolution: 1600x900@60.01hz becomes opera-beta  --window-size=1600,850 %U in Peppermint's menu and panel launchers.


Spoiler (click here to view / hide)
perknh@peppermint ~ $ inxi -Fz
System:    Host: peppermint Kernel: 4.10.0-42-generic x86_64 (64 bit) Desktop: N/A
           Distro: Peppermint Eight
Machine:   System: TOSHIBA product: Satellite C70-A v: PSCE2U-03E00S
           Mobo: Type2 - Board Vendor Name1 model: Type2 - Board Product Name1 v: Type2 - Board Version
           Bios: Insyde v: 1.30 date: 04/18/2014
CPU:       Dual core Intel Pentium 2020M (-MCP-) cache: 2048 KB
           clock speeds: max: 2400 MHz 1: 1409 MHz 2: 1598 MHz
Graphics:  Card: Intel 3rd Gen Core processor Graphics Controller
           Display Server: X.Org 1.19.3 drivers: (unloaded: fbdev,vesa)
           Resolution: 1600x900@60.01hz
           GLX Renderer: Mesa DRI Intel Ivybridge Mobile
           GLX Version: 3.0 Mesa 17.0.2
Audio:     Card Intel 7 Series/C210 Series Family High Definition Audio Controller
           driver: snd_hda_intel
           Sound: Advanced Linux Sound Architecture v: k4.10.0-42-generic
Network:   Card-1: Realtek RTL8188EE Wireless Network Adapter driver: rtl8188ee
           IF: wlp2s0 state: down mac: <filter>
           Card-2: Qualcomm Atheros AR8162 Fast Ethernet driver: alx
           IF: enp3s0 state: up speed: 100 Mbps duplex: full mac: <filter>
Drives:    HDD Total Size: 240.1GB (5.1% used)
           ID-1: /dev/sda model: PNY_CS1311_240GB size: 240.1GB
Partition: ID-1: / size: 95G used: 5.9G (7%) fs: ext4 dev: /dev/sda6
           ID-2: swap-1 size: 6.33GB used: 0.00GB (0%) fs: swap dev: /dev/sda5
RAID:      No RAID devices: /proc/mdstat, md_mod kernel module present
Sensors:   System Temperatures: cpu: 50.0C mobo: N/A
           Fan Speeds (in rpm): cpu: N/A
Info:      Processes: 173 Uptime: 3:37 Memory: 1693.4/5859.9MB
           Client: Shell (bash) inxi: 2.2.35
perknh@peppermint ~ $
[close]

i tried it but it didn't work, in fact i gave him any resolution and the window size didn't change at all. when i reduce the window size manually, the gtk system buttons appear but when i enlarge it they disappear.
i tried to change gtk/xfwm4 theme and it didn't change. Funny thing is that preview version used to work just fine.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on December 29, 2017, 05:48:19 pm
i tried it but it didn't work, in fact i gave him any resolution and the window size didn't change at all.

That's too bad, Ly.  It sounds as if the best browser for your computer isn't going to be Opera.  Have you tried the new Firefox browser yet?  It's impressive. :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Ly on December 30, 2017, 04:18:51 am
i tried it but it didn't work, in fact i gave him any resolution and the window size didn't change at all.

That's too bad, Ly.  It sounds as if the best browser for your computer isn't going to be Opera.  Have you tried the new Firefox browser yet?  It's impressive. :)
yeah, actually i'm running Chromium instead of firefox because it has the extensions i use and it's running fine. I'm using FireFox as a backup web browser in case anything "happens".
thanks for the help anyway :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on December 30, 2017, 06:34:48 am
Quote
i'm running Chromium instead of firefox because it has the extensions i use

Not something you hear every day :))
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on April 20, 2018, 07:24:00 am
In my experience Opera has worked best with Peppermint on my machines.  I like Vivaldi but have found it to be a bit slow.  Iridium is fast but I'm not sold on its security.  YMMV, however.   ;)

@mac

Good morning, mac,

I've found a nifty little open source extension (which is compatible with UBlock Origin) that has helped speed up my connections with Chromium-based browsers -- Vivaldi amongst them!  It's called Decentraleyes (https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/decentraleyes/ldpochfccmkkmhdbclfhpagapcfdljkj), and it deals with Content Delivery Networks (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Content_delivery_network), or CNDs.  My understanding is that our friends at Google often farm out who, or what, delivers our content through Google Hosted Libraries.  This extension, Decentraleyes, helps cut out the middleman, thus speeding up the entire process while giving us more private and secure connections.

At least that's my layman's understanding of this process. ;)


FAQs for Decentraleyes:

https://github.com/Synzvato/decentraleyes/wiki/Frequently-Asked-Questions
Title: Best Browser: FLOW - Share Things Between Peppermint Linux OS and Your Phone
Post by: VinDSL on April 27, 2018, 06:05:12 am
Do you send emails or messages to yourself so you won’t forget something cool you found online?

With FLOW you can share and keep links, images, videos and notes across your devices.

FLOW connects your Peppermint Opera desktop browser with Opera Touch, their mobile browser.

It’s a seamless connection between your phone and your personal computer.

Establishing the connection between Peppermint and your phone doesn't require a login, password or an account. 

(https://www-static.operacdn.com/static-heap/37/37a78e1548433565e3ff65036cb3d0a0d6194638/3.png)

SOURCE: https://www.opera.com/computer/features/flow

EXTRA CREDIT READING: https://www.opera.com/client/upgraded
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: mac on April 27, 2018, 06:31:06 am
Nice find, Perk.  Interesting.  ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on April 27, 2018, 11:53:54 am
Thanks, mac.  The difference this has made for my installation of Vivaldi in terms of speed has been like the difference between night and day.  Vivaldi for me now is markedly faster -- and I guess it's even more private and secure too.

But, like you say, your mileage may vary. ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: jamespandit on May 05, 2018, 06:20:13 am
Tried Yandex Browser yet?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on May 05, 2018, 06:31:08 pm
Tried Yandex Browser yet?

Hi jamespandit,

Welcome to Peppermint! :)

Yes, I've used Yandex browser off and on over the last year and a half.  I uninstalled it recently because, after a recent update, I couldn't get into its settings page.  Also, the same thing happened to a friend of mine:  she couldn't get into Yandex browser's setting page either.  Hey, these things happen, it's in beta!

This (https://forum.peppermintos.com/index.php/topic,1167.msg68118.html#msg68118) is, more or less, what my installation of Yandex browser looks like on my computer when I do run it.  Personally, I like Yandex browser.  It's sleek, quick, and minimalist. ;)

perknh


P.S.

Here (https://raamoprusland.nl/dossiers/economie/786-how-even-yandex-is-being-brought-under-control) is an interesting article on Yandex the company.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on August 22, 2018, 01:58:49 pm
Over the last several hours (which admittedly is not a lot of time) I've had a chance to play with Firefox Quantum, Waterfox, and Basilisk.  I've synced them all to my Firefox account, and they all running Peppermint's DDG search engine their default search engine.  I would just like to post here my initial observations while they're fresh in my mind.

As expected, the three browsers are behaviorally nearly identical -- their differences being mostly on which version of Firefox they are based.  There are some slight superficial differences between the browsers (the width of the search bar, or icon styles, or whether of not they've gone Quantum yet).

Currently Firefox Quantum stable is running version 61.0.1.  Waterfox is based on Firefox 56.2.2, while Basilisk is based on Firefox 52.9.  The thing that surprised me the most about Waterfox and Basilisk was that updating on both browsers was set for Never check for updates (not recommended: security risk).  That surprised me! :o  To be on the safer side of things, I set the the advance update feature of those two browsers to Automatically install updates (recommended: improved security).  Perhaps that was an unnecessary move on my part because the two browsers will most likely update themselves.  Still, I want to see what happens.

Waterfox was able to support four extensions I use -- Decentraleyes, ScriptSafe, uBlock Origin, and LastPass.  Basilisk was able to support two of the four extensions I use -- uBlock Origin and LastPass.  With both Decentraleyes and ScriptSafe I got the following message:  This add-on requires a newer version of Firefox (at least version 57.0). You are using Firefox 52.9.

On deciding which of these three browsers to set as my default, Chris Hoffman's two interesting opinion pieces for How-To Geek called Despite Firefox Quantum’s Success, Mozilla Has Lost Its Way (https://www.howtogeek.com/336493/despite-firefox-quantums-success-mozilla-has-lost-its-way/) and Why You Shouldn’t Use Firefox Forks Like Waterfox, Pale Moon, or Basilisk (https://www.howtogeek.com/335712/update-why-you-shouldnt-use-waterfox-pale-moon-or-basilisk/) helped me decide.  (I also recollected a post that VinDSL wrote some time back concerning Iridium browser (https://forum.peppermintos.com/index.php/topic,3035.msg29955.html#msg29955).  Although I'm running all three browsers (and am planning on continuing to do so), IMO Hoffman makes a sound argument for staying with Firefox -- especially if one is concerned with patches or security.

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: peppycrab on August 23, 2018, 03:59:10 pm
I'm a long time Pale Moon user/booster, but I've had good experience with  Chromium.
I've installed Opera several times (I was an Opera user back when you had to pay for it!) but for some reason it never "grabs" me.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on August 23, 2018, 05:59:38 pm
I'm a long time Pale Moon user/booster, but I've had good experience with  Chromium.
I've installed Opera several times (I was an Opera user back when you had to pay for it!) but for some reason it never "grabs" me.

One of many reasons I was drawn towards Peppermint years ago was Chromium browser.  From Peppermint 3 to Peppermint 8.1, I was either running Chromium or Opera or sometimes even Chrome.  But since Peppermint 9 I've been awestruck with the quality of Firefox Quantum.  Firefox no longer lags or skips when I write a Gmail, and it now supports all the extensions I was able to use before in the Chromium-based browsers. 

I haven't tried Pale Moon yet, but I have installed Basilisk and Waterfox, and I do take them out for a ride every now and then.  One day I'll look at Pale Moon too.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on August 23, 2018, 06:12:18 pm
For some reason, Opera runs very slow on my laptop and i switched to chromium a moth ago. Now with the new Firefox Quantum i don't know which is less memory consuming, Firefox or Chromium?
I've also wanted to give WaterFox a try but couldn't find an easy way to install/update it (apt-get...).

Hello Ly,

I found this resource online for Waterfox yesterday, and it worked fine for me.

Good luck! ;)

perknh

https://github.com/hawkeye116477/waterfox-deb

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: marifink on November 16, 2018, 09:09:47 am
How did you get  tired of it?) I just use it for my work and don't think what browser i'm using.... Chrome, chrome, only chrome...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: makey on November 18, 2018, 11:02:56 am
Hello well i recommend:

GNU IceCat is the GNU version of the Firefox browser
https://www.gnu.org/software/gnuzilla/

and

Mozilla  Extended Support Release
https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/organizations/ (https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/organizations/)

and if you are concern about your privacy take a read at : https://www.privacytools.io/ (https://www.privacytools.io/)

other like Chrome, are products of google even Chromium use google services, and based like brave or opera can collect data from you through the services of google.
i know no one browser is the perfect one but if you are concern use firefox or tor.

and one last recommendation for search engine use https://searx.me/ (https://searx.me/) is a good metasearch engine.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 18, 2018, 11:11:17 am
[...]and one last recommendation for search engine use https://searx.me/ (https://searx.me/) is a good metasearch engine.

I decided to give it a try, and yes, it passed the test.

It gave proper and complete results for the most beloved and berated patriot - the most banned individual - in His Majesty's former rebel colony  ;D

LINK: https://searx.me/?q=alex%20jones&categories=general&language=en-US

Nice one, makey!
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: makey on November 18, 2018, 05:06:01 pm

I decided to give it a try, and yes, it passed the test.

It gave proper and complete results for the most beloved and berated patriot - the most banned individual - in His Majesty's former rebel colony  ;D

LINK: https://searx.me/?q=alex%20jones&categories=general&language=en-US

Nice one, makey!

Glad to give that info.  8)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: kloos on November 19, 2018, 06:59:35 am
I used to be a staunch Firefox fan.  Have used it for years. But over the last 6 months it has started to crash too often.  I did the rounds trying ever other browser out and eventually settled with Opera.  It works well across all platforms and seems pretty stable with lots of extras should you need them.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: makey on November 19, 2018, 05:25:44 pm
Someone has tried https://beakerbrowser.com/ (https://beakerbrowser.com/)

in the main page says:

A browser for the next-generation Web Beaker is an experimental browser for exploring and building the peer-to-peer Web.

What do you think?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 19, 2018, 06:33:37 pm
Someone has tried https://beakerbrowser.com/ (https://beakerbrowser.com/)

Interesting but, no, I haven't tried Beaker browser.

I'm afraid I'm hooked on the *new* Opera browser(s).  :)

The 'Whatsapp Web Extension (https://addons.opera.com/en/extensions/details/app-for-whatsapptm-web/)', by itself, is worth the price of admission, not to mention the built-in (pseudo) VPN feature (https://www.opera.com/computer/features/free-vpn).
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 20, 2018, 03:35:55 pm
I'm not a fan of electron apps (massive/slow), or appimages/snaps/flatpaks, or Chromium based browsers for that matter .. so I'm afraid Beaker is unlikely to be my cup of tea, no matter how interesting the concept.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: adminmike on November 20, 2018, 05:30:34 pm
So Im gettting tired of all these default browsers Chrome, Chromium, Firefox, Opera what are the best ones that you have found
Opera 12 the best of the best :) And Pale Moon is good. For WinXP - K-Meleon ::)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 20, 2018, 05:42:13 pm
Is Opera 12 still going ?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 20, 2018, 09:04:59 pm
This is hot off the press from computerworlduk.  Again, Peppermint gets it right! ;)

Best browsers for privacy

By Christina Mercer (https://www.computerworlduk.com/author/christina-mercer/) for computerworlduk

Quote
...if you are privacy conscious you will want to opt for an open source solution that receives regular updates with an active community, as well as supporting addons for disabling tracking and so on.

While Tor is the most anonymous browser technically, the Tor network is frequently monitored by authorities, so using it can make a user stick out in a way that a more conventional browser doesn't. To be truly secure with a Tor browser probably means locking down your system with a secure basic Linux OS such as Tails, and using networks that are two or three steps removed from your home Wi-Fi – like public networks.

For most users, Firefox checks all the boxes. While it is by no means airtight (nothing is), you can build it out with enough protections in place to minimise intrusions to your browsing and so Firefox and the stripped down Firefox Quantum gets our vote.-- Christina Mercer


https://www.computerworlduk.com/galleries/applications/best-browsers-for-privacy-3628363/
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: adminmike on November 21, 2018, 03:37:29 pm
Is Opera 12 still going ?
O ye :P If you read the usually (text) articles on the sites - it is a very good browser. Reads RSS without plugins, can download cool downloads, blocks extra content without plugins...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 21, 2018, 04:06:43 pm
I'm running Opera 18, of course, but the one thing that I really loved about the pre-Chromium versions of Opera was the ability to put the tabs on the bottom of the windows, instead of the top.

AFAIK, nobody has figured out how to do that with Chrom(ium) browsers  :(

Example...


(http://vindsl.com/images/Screenshot%20at%202011-08-07%2005:22:25.png)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 21, 2018, 06:02:14 pm
AFAIK, nobody has figured out how to do that with Chrom(ium) browsers  :(

What about Vivaldi, VinDSL? :-\

https://vivaldi.com/es/blog/10-tab-management-tricks/

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 21, 2018, 06:33:40 pm
Oh oh, now you did it...  :o
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 21, 2018, 10:21:32 pm
Oh oh, now you did it...  :o

Truth is, I should probably be using Firefox, Chromium, and Vivaldi myself.  To the privacy purists, there is a concern about Vivaldi's use of a "unique user ID" (https://www.ghacks.net/2018/01/30/vivaldi-browser-privacy/),  though it doesn't sound like too much of an issue to me.

I've got to say, though, I use Firefox more and more on the computer -- at least half the time now.  On my Android phone however, I'm now on an Ecosia kick, and that's a Chromium-based browser.  Ecosia browser appears to have a dated search engine; but it also claims to plant trees, so I'm giving it a pass. ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 22, 2018, 06:51:28 am
Cool, a FF convert .. we'll stuff it to Google yet :))
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 23, 2018, 09:01:58 am
Cool, a FF convert .. we'll stuff it to Google yet :)) 

There's no question about it, my experience with Firefox Quantum in Peppermint 9 has been a game changer for me.  You're right, PCNetSpec, I am a FF convert! :)

The next cheap, bang around laptop I buy will most likely be a HP Stream and NOT a Chromebook, and that's largely due to my experience here with Firefox.  See, Peppermint, in it's own small way, is changing market demand!  ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 25, 2018, 01:04:06 am
Talking about Firefox and Google, I have a feeling a major realignment is about to occur at Google.  And where did I first hear about this?  I learned about it on Firefox's magnificent Start Page! :)

We have a saying here in the States, and it goes like this:  "If (when) mama ain't happy, ain't nobody happy," and I can assure you the women in the link below are NOT happy campers with their jobs at Google right now at all.   I've got a feeling there's about to be a significant change with the work environment at Google very soon.  We'll see! ;)

After 20,000 workers walked out, Google said it got the message. The workers disagree.

By Shirin Ghaffary and Eric Johnson for recode (https://www.recode.net/)

Quote
“You don’t have 20,000 people in the streets planned in three days if there isn’t something deeply, structurally wrong,” added Whittaker, the founder of Google’s Open Research group.

https://www.recode.net/2018/11/21/18105719/google-walkout-real-change-organizers-protest-discrimination-kara-swisher-recode-decode-podcast
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 28, 2018, 03:57:39 pm
This is a good article -- it's a snapshot, really -- about the current state of affairs at Mozilla.  I hope the number of people using Firefox begins to grow again. 

Google-Firefox search deal gives Mozilla more money to push privacy

Too bad fewer people are using Mozilla's web browser.


By Stephen Shankland for c|net

https://www.cnet.com/news/google-firefox-search-deal-gives-mozilla-more-money-to-push-privacy/

Quote
Too bad Mozilla is arguably losing leverage just when we could use it the most.

Over the last year, the number of people using Firefox monthly has dipped from about 300 million to about 277 million, according to Mozilla's own figures.

---

And Firefox trails Google's Chrome and Apple's Safari, too. Firefox usage slipped over the last year from 6 percent to 5 percent, according to analytics firm StatCounter, which measures how often browsers are used to view websites among its network. That's third place to Google's dominant Chrome browser at 62 percent and Apple's Safari at 15 percent.

Firefox doesn't need to dominate the internet. But it does need a strong enough presence to influence the development of standards so the web remains an openly developed platform, not just whatever works with Chrome. -- Stephen Shankland

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 29, 2018, 03:23:47 pm
The world needs FF...

to provide a competitor that keeps Google / Chrome in line .. think how much Google would walk all over your privacy if you had no option to leave.

to champion privacy and open standards all over the web.

and because FF is simply better than Chrome in every way .. no matter what the sheeple numbers say :P
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on December 03, 2018, 01:54:42 pm
Agree... the world needs FF
But FF, should also know where it's running  :D
Somehow, it now believes I'm running it on a mobile device  :-\

(https://i.imgur.com/iZoGgCX.png)

Don't get me wrong... I only use FF on all my devices  8)

By the way,...
It seems like the "lightweight" midori is back from the dead. After months (years maybe?) a new version based on the relatively new webkit2gtk (not webkitgtk2) has been released https://www.midori-browser.org/

EDIT: Confirmed.... It has been forked and it's alive again. The previous news dated 2016  ::)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on December 03, 2018, 02:49:37 pm
Is the FF thing down to syncing .. I mean has your mobile browser installed a plugin, which sync is now asking if you want on your desktop ?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on December 03, 2018, 04:18:23 pm
Nope! I really dislike syncing and try to keep my devices unaware of each other... strange!!
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on December 03, 2018, 04:54:33 pm
Yep weird .. I've not seem this behaviour :-\
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on December 03, 2018, 04:58:32 pm
Don't worry... I'll just ignore that.
Just reporting  ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on December 08, 2018, 05:56:58 pm
I used to be a staunch Firefox fan.  Have used it for years. But over the last 6 months it has started to crash too often.

This is beginning to annoy me now too @kloos , yet a new layer has appeared though. now when I close a firefox SSB a few minutes later the Firefox has experienced a crash box appears, then reopens the ssb I had already forgotten that I'd closed
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: drowzee1872 on December 08, 2018, 09:36:21 pm
Opera is great, and comes with a VPN option built in... however I am not sure how secure the VPN is....use at your own risk. That said it is fast. The only snag is that H.264 codecs that update with your system do not update with the browser. So you may find video files on some social network sites do not play.

Vivaldi is very fast and highly customizable. It is also gaining in popularity.

Chrome or Chromium are popular choices.

For me I am back using Firefox. I really like the major overhaul it seems to have had, and it works well for me with Peppermint.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: drowzee1872 on December 08, 2018, 09:39:12 pm
I used to be a staunch Firefox fan.  Have used it for years. But over the last 6 months it has started to crash too often.

This is beginning to annoy me now too @kloos , yet a new layer has appeared though. now when I close a firefox SSB a few minutes later the Firefox has experienced a crash box appears, then reopens the ssb I had already forgotten that I'd closed

Got to be honest, I have many SSB's set up through ICE and Firefox. I have no issues.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on December 09, 2018, 12:02:57 am
I've got a browmance going on with this new Firefox Quantum browser... Let me just say it, Firefox Quantum is smokin'! :)

Now, I did discover that MyADP (Automatic Data Processing (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_Data_Processing)) doesn't play well with ScriptSafe in Firefox, although MyADP does work perfectly well within Chrome even with ScriptSafe enabled.  I wonder if the reason for this is Google's cozy relationship with Adobe, whereas if you disable ScriptSafe in Firefox, MyADP ends up working just fine within Firefox.   Is this problem Adobe related in some way or another, or might this have something to do with a conflict between the anti-tracking feature within Firefox and the code within ScriptSafe itself?  I really don't know what the problem is, but the solution is simple:  just disable ScriptSafe within Firefox when going to MyADP! ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on December 09, 2018, 10:31:40 am
Got to be honest, I have many SSB's set up through ICE and Firefox. I have no issues.

Can't say that I have too many problems either save this weird hiccup of getting the error dialog many minutes after closing an SSB instance myself. Or having the Firefox is already running error appear when trying to reopen a previously closed SSB... I need to pay closer attention to which machine and when this happens   :-\
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on December 09, 2018, 10:36:41 am
I've got a browmance going on with this new Firefox Quantum browser... Let me just say it, Firefox Quantum is smokin'! :) 

I guess I've been asleep for a while, just hit the Help About Firefox to see if I have this Quantum thing... I do 63.0.3 ... and noted:

 
Code: [Select]
Mozilla Firefox for Peppermint
peppermint - 1.0

>:D
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on December 09, 2018, 01:08:35 pm
The world needs FF...

to provide a competitor that keeps Google / Chrome in line .. think how much Google would walk all over your privacy if you had no option to leave.

to champion privacy and open standards all over the web...

There's another blow coming to browser competition soon.  Believe it or not, even Windows notorious Edge browser will be adopting Chromium's Blink rendering engine over the coming year. :o


Mozilla: Why Microsoft Edge's switch to Google's Chromium is bad news

By Liam Tung (https://www.zdnet.com/meet-the-team/eu/liam-tung/) for ZDNet

https://www.zdnet.com/article/mozilla-why-microsoft-edges-switch-to-googles-chromium-is-bad-news/


Here's some background information, also from ZDNet, explaining why this happening to Edge browser.

Microsoft Edge: What went wrong, what's next

By Ed Bott for The Ed Bott Report (https://www.zdnet.com/blog/bott/)

https://www.zdnet.com/article/microsoft-edge-what-went-wrong-whats-next/
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on December 24, 2018, 10:19:09 pm
For consideration... one wonders if it would break one's ICE SSBs? https://www.ghacks.net/2018/12/24/librefox-firefox-with-privacy-enhancements/ (https://www.ghacks.net/2018/12/24/librefox-firefox-with-privacy-enhancements/)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on December 25, 2018, 07:38:16 am
The project sounds interesting, spence.  The project sounds like what Epic Browser aims to do with Chromium browser.  I also notice that the uBlock Origin extension gets the A-O;kay!  :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on December 25, 2018, 06:38:36 pm
It **probably** would break SSB's .. but if you test it, and it does, let me know .. I can always look at building you a modified ICE.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Andrey Bailey on January 15, 2019, 08:48:29 am
For me, Chrome is the best browser for browsing.  :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on January 15, 2019, 09:50:43 am
Welcome to the forum Andrey :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on January 15, 2019, 02:25:40 pm
For me, Chrome is the best browser for browsing.  :)

Yes, welcome Andrey!  I've done a complete 180 since the release of Peppermint 9.  Before, you couldn't tear me away from Chromium browser:  Now I'm a Firefox Quantum covert!  My wife, mrs.perknh, is currently transitioning from Chrome to Chromium when running our laptop computers.  My general push these days is to have us use open source software as much as possible.  I ran Chromium-based browsers for years,though -- Chrome, Opera, Iridium and even Yandex for a spell! :o  In general, Chromium-based browsers are easy to use, and they usually work very well too.





Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Slaninka on January 15, 2019, 02:39:45 pm
I, for example use firefox for my everyday browsing, but I have there many privacy concious addons activated, which sometimes makes user experience worse,
and also I have had problem with some web pages witch were  not functioning properly with firefox.
Because of this reason I use chromium for all my social media, as a backup, and now also for my ice applications.  :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on January 15, 2019, 03:10:24 pm
I, for example use firefox for my everyday browsing, but I have there many privacy concious addons activated, which sometimes makes user experience worse,
and also I have had problem with some web pages witch were  not functioning properly with firefox.
Because of this reason I use chromium for all my social media, as a backup, and now also for my ice applications.  :)

That's a good combo.  And they're both open source browsers too! :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on January 21, 2019, 06:11:29 am
You guys know that I'm a Firefox guy and I run it on all my systems. Yes, even on Android  8)
Now, I always had a weak spot for Midori...  its being developed again and the devs at NetBSD quickly packaged it when I issued a request  ;D

So, I've been toying around with it for an hour or so and I must say, I like it  :D

(https://i.imgur.com/balZgjQ.jpg)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on January 21, 2019, 08:08:41 am
Hi pin,

I used to use Midori years ago too, and I'm glad to see it's been developed again.  I guess I'm spoiled with Firefox now.  I miss a plus tab button, a zoom button, and a bookmarks bar, but I'm glad to see it's coming back to life.

Have you tried using Startpage within it?  Yes, it will bring up Startpage, and it will even allow Startpage to list your search items, but once you click on an item -- say, something from Wikipedia -- nothing!  Are you having that experience too?

Midori sure is zippy, though!  Thanks for mentioning it. :)

perknh
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on January 21, 2019, 08:29:07 am
Some of those features are available now...

(https://i.imgur.com/htjKtXm.jpg)

I don't like the initial "Speed Dial" page, it looks awful with pixeled huge icons. I'm looking if I can disable it compleatly.
Some sites, so far just imgur, make my cpu load rocket to over 70%  :o

Wikipedia is working fine, but I still have to figure out how to enable html5 so I can play videos or watch tv  :-\
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on January 21, 2019, 11:32:35 am
Some of those features are available now...

(https://i.imgur.com/htjKtXm.jpg)

I don't like the initial "Speed Dial" page, it looks awful with pixeled huge icons. I'm looking if I can disable it compleatly.
Some sites, so far just imgur, make my cpu load rocket to over 70%  :o

Wikipedia is working fine, but I still have to figure out how to enable html5 so I can play videos or watch tv  :-\

Try searching for something in Wikipedia through Startpage.  I know Wikipedia works through DDG.  It's Startpage I'm wondering about. :-\

pin, what's cool here is that Midori is back in development.  It would nice to have Midori as a backup browser --  that is, if enogh of it works right! ;)

I noticed Midori isn't in Snynaptic any longer; it's from the Snap Store now.   Midori is the first program from the Snap Store installation I've ever tried, and  it worked just like a Flatpak.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: murraymint on January 21, 2019, 12:25:04 pm

Have you tried using Startpage within it?  Yes, it will bring up Startpage, and it will even allow Startpage to list your search items, but once you click on an item -- say, something from Wikipedia -- nothing!  Are you having that experience too?


I've just compiled it from source and it does open Startpage search result links, including Wikipedia ones. Must be some problem with your snap install.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on January 21, 2019, 02:52:13 pm
I've just compiled it from source and it does open Startpage search result links, including Wikipedia ones. Must be some problem with your snap install.

You compiled it (Midori?) from source? :o 

Wow!  That's impressive!! 8)

The problem must be with my installation.  Thanks, murraymint.

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: murraymint on January 21, 2019, 03:30:52 pm
Yeah, it's just a case of following step-by-step instructions in the readme file within the tarball, which includes installing a few dependencies (and another one which was needed to compile it). I used to like Midori so it's good to see it back again  :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: handcode on January 24, 2019, 10:43:09 am
As far as I experienced on my old machine, Opera is better for watching video and surfing Facebook, very smooth. 2nd browser is Yandex, I used it because it could sync to my phone and has truly good adblock on phone. 3rd is Chrome stable or Firefox.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on February 02, 2019, 10:51:57 am
@murraymint
Do you still have Midori installed? Not the snap version, but the one you built from source?
If so, would you mind test one thing for me?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: murraymint on February 02, 2019, 12:31:03 pm
Yes, it's still here on PM7. What did you want me to try?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 02, 2019, 01:01:10 pm
Dunno what pin wants you to try .. but what happens if you run:
Code: [Select]
midori --app=https://forum.peppermintos.com
in a terminal .. does it open as an SSB ? .. or does it still completely ignore the "--app=" option and open with all the tabs/toolbars/etc. (normal browser window) ?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: murraymint on February 02, 2019, 01:02:49 pm
Yes, that looks OK. It doesn't remember that I've maximised the window so the second time it opens in the same small window.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 02, 2019, 01:03:41 pm
did it open AS AN SSB ? .. ie. no toolbars/tabs/etc. ?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: murraymint on February 02, 2019, 01:05:53 pm
Yep, no tabs, no toolbar. Right-click context menu seems to be disabled too.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 02, 2019, 01:10:55 pm
Okay I was beginning to think they'd fixed it (possibly for ICE) until you mentioned no right-click context menus .. which **could** be a hindrance, I'll have to take a looksee.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on February 02, 2019, 01:57:22 pm
Could you confirm the following...
Have a window with htop running, launch midori and go to imgur.
Does one, and just one of your cpu cores goes mad and jumps to 100% usage??

Now, if that happened, could you check which version of webkit do you have on your system?

Thanks!

Got to go. But will explain it next time...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: murraymint on February 02, 2019, 02:24:00 pm
Does one, and just one of your cpu cores goes mad and jumps to 100% usage??

Not really, one goes to about 94% when the site loads but then they're all fairly steady after that at around 40%.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on February 02, 2019, 03:06:34 pm
Damn it  >:(
Ok! 100% was maybe a bit too much, but...
Thank you murray  :-*

Oh! Could you tell me which webkit version please.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: murraymint on February 02, 2019, 04:22:31 pm
Ok, it seems to be webkit2gtk-4.0.  ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on February 02, 2019, 05:08:52 pm
Really appreciated murray!
Unfortunately Ubuntu calls the package in a different way. I mean, the latest upstream version from the 14th of January this year is 2.23.3

Background...
I've requested Midori 7.0 on NetBSD pkgsrc-WIP in December. The package was quickly pushed to current within a week. A few weeks ago it hit NetBSD stable and I've pulled it to my system. But, its randomly eating my cpu  :o
Today I had some free time and intalled it on Void to check if it was a BSD thing... it was not, its doing the same there. So, I'm trying to find where this thing is coming from, so that I can report it, either to Midori or, most probably to webkit.

So, I really appreciate you checking this. Otherwise, I would have to build it from source just to test.
If you look for the package in Synaptic, you can find the correct version.

Sorry if I'm a PITA  :'(
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 02, 2019, 05:44:28 pm
probably easiest to just post the output from:
Code: [Select]
dpkg -l | grep libwebkit
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: murraymint on February 02, 2019, 05:55:57 pm
Code: [Select]
$ dpkg -l | grep libwebkit
ii  libwebkit2gtk-4.0-37:amd64                  2.20.5-0ubuntu0.16.04.1                      amd64        Web content engine library for GTK+
ii  libwebkit2gtk-4.0-dev:amd64                 2.20.5-0ubuntu0.16.04.1                      amd64        Web content engine library for GTK+ - development files
ii  libwebkitgtk-1.0-0:amd64                    2.4.11-0ubuntu0.1                            amd64        Web content engine library for GTK+
ii  libwebkitgtk-1.0-common                     2.4.11-0ubuntu0.1                            all          Web content engine library for GTK+ - data files
ii  libwebkitgtk-3.0-0:amd64                    2.4.11-0ubuntu0.1                            amd64        Web content engine library for GTK+
ii  libwebkitgtk-3.0-common                     2.4.11-0ubuntu0.1                            all          Web content engine library for GTK+ - data files
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on February 03, 2019, 02:08:31 am
Thank you for your input.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on February 08, 2019, 04:53:13 am
Got a quick question for Fx users:

Are there any WhatsApp & SMS add-ons available for Fx?

Opera has a built-in WhatsApp feature, and I added an extension called MightyText for SMS. These allow me to access WhatsApp and Messages (not Messenger) from Opera, on my Peppermint desktop/laptop, without ever needing to touch my phone. They automagically communicate and interact directly with the apps on my Android. They're not standalone web proggies.

Anything like those available for Fx? If so, how good do they work?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 08, 2019, 06:04:48 am
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/search/?q=WhatsApp&platform=Linux&appver=65.0
and though MightyText itself doesn't appear to be available, there are these:
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/search/?q=SMS&platform=Linux&appver=65.0
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on February 08, 2019, 02:11:41 pm
I know you guys have a love-fest going, with Mozilla - and that's cool.  I'm starting to warm up to Firefox again - but I haven't routinely used it (outside testing) since ver 3.5, hence the question. LoL  ;D

The thing is, I H-A-T-E 'smart' phones. Unfortunately, they're an evil, modern-day necessity. And, being able to remotely access WhatsApp & Messages from my browser is a godsend... and a must.

Speaking of phones, I ordered Google Fi, yesterday. When I'm traveling between here and Vegas by car, there's a deadly stretch of road where my Boost Mobile phone doesn't have roaming available - plus it doesn't work at all, outside the USA.

I'm basically incommunicado for an hour, before it connects to cell towers again. I might as well be on the moon, with meteorites whizzing past. The only thing separating me from death and destruction is that little white line, painted in the middle of the road.

According to their coverage map, Google Fi works on this desolate, 50-mile stretch of highway U.S.93 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Route_93#Arizona):
Quote
This highway was known to be one of the deadliest highways in America until recently. The years of improvement
have made it a much safer road to travel, according to the Federal Highway Administration.[2] *
* Bullpucky, it still is ~ VinDSL

Google Fi automagically works in 200+ countries and territories without a bunch of nonsense - like, carrying a pocket full of SIM cards, et cetera.  Plus, Google Fi (formerly Project Fi) is offering high and mid-range phones at pennies on the wholesale dollar, in order to suck you into their alternate universe.

I'm getting a highly-rated $400 USD Motorola X4 for $150, with a $50 service credit, upon activation, e.g. a $400 smarty (with Google Fi switching capes) for $100.  It's upgradeable to Android 9 'Pie', too. They should have called it 'Peppermint',  but I digress...

Google AI continues to think I'm in the Ukraine - and it's getting worse. The bots have convinced themselves that I'm a Russian haxor, and block me at every opportunity. It's kinda fun, until I need to conduct serious business online. Sooooo, I used Fx to 'fool' them into 'thinking' I'm an American in Arizona, when purchasing the phone and setting up my account. Fx to the rescue. YaY!

The more I play around with Fx, the more I like it. Having WhatsApp & Messages available in Fx might be preferable to Opera, when I'm on the trot, with my new Moto.

It's kinda sad that I need to choose between Chinese communists and New World Order globalists, for my communications,  but that's the way it is these days  ::)

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 08, 2019, 03:15:51 pm
It's kinda sad that I need to choose between Chinese communists and New World Order globalists, for my communications

That and pretty much everything else these days.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on February 08, 2019, 05:43:22 pm
Remember the Froch Peppermint pic? I use it for the wall on my Opera Speed Dial


(http://vindsl.com/images/Screenshot_2019-02-08_15:18:52.png)


That's the attitude to have...  8)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 09, 2019, 03:43:21 pm
...I'm starting to warm up to Firefox again - but I haven't routinely used it (outside testing) since ver 3.5, hence the question. LoL  ;D

I'm glad you're warming up to Firefox again, VinDSL, because the privacy policy at Opera is changing very soon -- in just a matter of days.

https://www.opera.com/privacy

Amongst other things, gone will be the words:

Quote
We treat your personal data as required by law. We are a Norwegian company and we follow Norwegian data-security laws as well as other national legislation, as needed. We require that our suppliers successfully pass security assessments and prove their compliance with applicable laws and industry standards.

Source:  https://www.opera.com/privacy/archive

Also, its mailing address will be changing from Norway to Singapore.

[EDIT]

I made an error with my sources.  In case anyone saw the error, I was trying to see whether or not Americans could somehow slip though the cracks and become protected by the EU's new data protection rules by using Yandex browser.  Europeans outside of Russia have many more data protections using Yandex browser, or any browser for that matter, than those using Yandex browser from within Russia.  But, no, I could find no assurance that those EU data protections would be granted to Americans who choose to download Yandex browser here in the States.  If we want such data protections, our data protection rules would need to be changed here first.

It's kinda sad that I need to choose between Chinese communists and New World Order globalists, for my communications,  but that's the way it is these days  ::)

VinDSL summed up the state of affairs for us here in the States pretty darn succinctly. ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 10, 2019, 12:19:04 pm
I know you guys have a love-fest going, with Mozilla - and that's cool. 

Well, not always.  Every now and then Firefox acts up.   For example, here's a link that works for me in Chromium but not in Firefox.

https://www.zdnet.com/pictures/all-the-chromium-based-browsers/
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on February 10, 2019, 01:25:00 pm
It works here  :-\ Firefox on Android...

EDIT: Works with Firefox on Peppermint also  :-\

(https://i.imgur.com/8XgcNLW.png)

EDIT2: Hi again, ...it works on Midori on NetBSD also... I don't see any problem. Maybe one of your extensions is blocking it   ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 10, 2019, 02:43:23 pm
Working in FF for me too.

If a site works in one browser but not another, it's pretty much always going to be a plugin, a setting, a browser cache or stored cookie issue.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 10, 2019, 06:41:49 pm
I had to change the Content Blocking from Strict to Standard.  This changed Connections to Not Secure because of ZDNet's images  For what it's worth, this is the first site within Firefox with which I encountered this problem.

Thank you, gentlemen, for clicking on the link.  Still, I don't know why clicking onto the next arrow worked for me in Chromium but not in Firefox.  With the exception of Decentraleyes, I use the same extensions in both browsers. (The extensions were not my problem.)

What should I conclude here?  Is Firefox protecting me better than Chromium here?   Or is ZDNet simply working better within Chromium than within Firefox?  I don't know what I should make of this experience. :-\

Again, thank you, both.  ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: murraymint on February 10, 2019, 08:15:46 pm
It's probably some fancy website coding being used that the browser may deem potentially suspicious, if not a redirect then something to do with the slideshow.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on February 11, 2019, 03:00:08 am
...Still, I don't know why clicking onto the next arrow worked for me in Chromium but not in Firefox...
That, is also working here...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 11, 2019, 07:43:30 am
The non-working "Next" button is a function of the Firefox tracker blocking feature.

In Firefox, go to:-

Edit > Preferences > Privacy & Security (tab)

and change Browser Content - Content Blocking to "Standard" .. then reload that website, and I'll bet the "Next" button will now work.

Basically it's Firefox doing what you told it to do and protecting you from tracking .. it's all about privacy and user CHOICE (rather than Google Chrome/Chromiums 'you WILL be tracked whether you like it or not') ;)

Or put another way - It's not Firefox that's broken here :D



Or read here for how to 'whitelist' that website
https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/content-blocking?as=u&utm_source=inproduct
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 11, 2019, 08:49:06 am
The non-working "Next" button is a function of the Firefox tracker blocking feature.

I didn't know that.  Thanks, PCNetSpec.  I've now whitelisted the site.


Basically it's Firefox doing what you told it to do and protecting you from tracking .. it's all about privacy and user CHOICE (rather than Google Chrome/Chromiums 'you WILL be tracked whether you like it or not') ;)

Hey, somebody's got to keep Privacy Badger (https://www.eff.org/privacybadger/faq#What-is-Privacy-Badger) in business!


Or put another way - It's not Firefox that's broken here :D 

You're right!  But I've STILL enriched this thread by sharing another perfectly fine example of PEBCAK (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/PEBCAK)!!!  :))



Thank you, pin, murraymint, and PCNetSpec. :)



Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 11, 2019, 10:01:49 am
Or put another way - It's not Firefox that's broken here :D 

You're right!  But I've STILL enriched this thread by sharing another perfectly fine example of PEBCAK (https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/PEBCAK)!!!  :))

What I meant was:-

Or put another way - It's not Firefox that's broken here, it's Chrome/Chromium :D
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 15, 2019, 05:15:17 am
The thing is, I H-A-T-E 'smart' phones. Unfortunately, they're an evil, modern-day necessity. And, being able to remotely access WhatsApp & Messages from my browser is a godsend... and a must.

If my arithmetic is correct, I've pulled the plug 3 times on my smartphone, but I've always returned to it.  I use it for two-factor authentication (2FA).  And there are now so many ways sites do 2FA, a smartphone has become a necessity.   These days, if we want to do our computing securely online, we pretty much have to have a smartie nearby.



It's not Firefox that's broken here, it's Chrome/Chromium

I wish I could figure out what data Chromium/Chrome is gathering from us.  Since we've been using Google's syncing feature for years, I can't see what the difference is, practically speaking, between using Chromium or Chrome.  At the end of the day, Google still ends up with all of our data.  From what I can tell, the beauty of using Chrome, as opposed to Chromium, is that it's always kept up-to-date in Peppermint -- which, unfortunately, is not the case when using Ubuntu's Chromium browser. :(

I use sync with Firefox also, so I would think Firefox must have as much data on me now as Google must have -- whatever that data is! :-\
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 15, 2019, 05:36:30 am
As far as I'm aware Chromium is kept up-to-date .. it just takes a little longer to filter down to the main repos.

The only difference between Chrome and Chromium is - all development as far as I'm aware is carried out in Chromium, when Google consider it "ready" they add the the third party proprietary stuff such as pepperflash (flash licensed from Adobe), and widevine (licenced from who knows, but for Netflix DRM and such) and call it "Chrome"

So in fact Chromium is always ahead of Chrome (at least during development) ;)

AFAIK, they're released together(ish) .. it just takes time for Chromium to be packaged (and tested?) for distros repos.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 15, 2019, 07:11:47 am
Chromium browser is at Version 71.0.3578.98 (Official Build) Built on Ubuntu , running on Peppermint 9 (64-bit).  While Google Chrome browser is at Version 72.0.3626.109 (Official Build) (64-bit).

I know Chromium is cutting edge, but Ubuntu's team tries to keep Chromium as much like Google Chrome Stable as possible -- without the proprietary software, of course.  But, if we don't run Flash, and we don't run Netflix, and we don't send user statistics and crash reports back to Google, but we enable sync; what do we have here other than a browser that's usually a tad bit behind Chrome Stable?

Don't get me wrong, I've used Chromium in Peppermint since Peppermint 3, and it's as solid as a rock.  But I noticed recently that Gmail's dynamic themes weren't changing as quickly in Chromium as they were in Chrome, and that's when I started paying more attention to the different versions.  That said, sometimes I think the Gmail's dynamic themes work even better in Firefox than they do in Chrome, but maybe that's just my mind playing tricks on me.  I don't know if this is really the case for certain. :-\



Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 15, 2019, 07:18:26 am
Yeah but IIRC Chrome only received an update a couple of days ago (or was it yesterday) .. so it'll take a few days for Chromium to be built from source, tested, then uploaded to the upstream repos .. give em a chance ;)

I'm not suggesting you use Chromium instead of Chrome .. if I were making ANY suggestion it'd be to use Firefox ;) .. use whichever suits you.

I was just attempting to correct your earlier statement that seemed to suggest upstream don't keep Chromium up-to-date.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 15, 2019, 09:22:50 am
Thanks, PCNetSpec.  Yeah, upstream is Chromium (which can be extremely unstable and why Ubuntu's team is trying to keep us with a stable version of it) and furthest downstream is Google Chrome which is supposed to be rock solid but comes with the no-nos of added branding, potential tracking, and proprietary software (so is therefore not included in FOSS repositories).  There are also Canary (for Windows users --very unstable), as well as Chrome Dev and Chrome Beta for anyone on any platform to try.

I am running Firefox, but I sometimes wonder if the way I use my browser if I'm not just going from McDonald's to Burger King.  No matter what, I still end up with a burger, some fries, and a sugary drink -- meaning, in my case, Gmail, Google News, and YouTube.  Google still has me, one way or the other by the nape of the neck, no matter what browser I use.

Pound for pound, I guess, Firefox is the more respectful browser (between Firefox and Chrome) when it comes to the protection of personal privacy ...I think/hope!.  Anyway, I like Firefox a lot now.  And with its Pocket articles, builtin tracking protections, dark theming, and its speed, Firefox is now putting other browsers to shame! :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: murraymint on February 15, 2019, 09:43:07 am

I am running Firefox, but I sometimes wonder if the way I use my browser if I'm not just going from McDonald's to Burger King.  No matter what, I still end up with a burger, some fries, and a sugary drink

It just means walking to a more remote car park to get a better burger. Or is that stretching the analogy too far?

 :D
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: dullblade2 on February 15, 2019, 11:47:06 am
    ???      do not know anything about the chrome brothers, but my money is on FF.   I'm all in, especially since I have connected several devices to FF sync.   Their sync feature is a powerful incentive and will either be a colossal mistake to use if they ever get hacked or a good way to propagate settings and bookmarks across your devices.  But I'm walking on eggs wondering if it is a mistake  to provide so much attack surface to cyberspace.   It is probably the lazy way to save your web-links and sign-ins.   I would like to hear if anyone thinks it is a terrible idea to use FF sync feature across a couple of laptops and a couple of phones.   Or if there is a more intelligent way....    FF has done a pretty good job over the years, has good bones and a good heritage, but they have had their hiccups.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on February 15, 2019, 12:11:30 pm
Don't know if its bad or not?! I HATE sync between machines  >:(
I always answer no, never ask ... (ever)... again!
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 15, 2019, 03:51:19 pm
    ???      do not know anything about the chrome brothers, but my money is on FF.   I'm all in, especially since I have connected several devices to FF sync.   Their sync feature is a powerful incentive and will either be a colossal mistake to use if they ever get hacked or a good way to propagate settings and bookmarks across your devices.  But I'm walking on eggs wondering if it is a mistake  to provide so much attack surface to cyberspace.   It is probably the lazy way to save your web-links and sign-ins.   I would like to hear if anyone thinks it is a terrible idea to use FF sync feature across a couple of laptops and a couple of phones.   Or if there is a more intelligent way....    FF has done a pretty good job over the years, has good bones and a good heritage, but they have had their hiccups.

This is just my opinion, dullblade2, but I wouldn't worry too much about using the sync features of any of these well-known browsers.  If you would like to give yourself a little more peace of mind when using sync, you might consider adding  two-factor authentication (https://geekermag.com/set-up-firefox-two-factor-authentication/) (2FA) or two-step authentication (https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb/secure-firefox-account-two-step-authentication) to your Firefox account.  I'm using Authy (https://authy.com/) for my Firefox account and it's all working just fine for me, but any of the well-respected authenticator apps ought to work just as well as Authy for adding extra protection to your Firefox account. ;)


P.S.

If you do decide to add 2FA to your Firefox account, remember to save a copy of Firefox's backup codes when Firefox displays them to you.  You never know when they may come in handy down the line.  ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 15, 2019, 04:35:26 pm
I'm with pin .. I don't use sync, not necessarily because of any security/privacy concerns, but just because I like to have my machines browsers with different settings.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 15, 2019, 05:27:10 pm
I'm with pin .. I don't use sync, not necessarily because of any security/privacy concerns, but just because I like to have my machines browsers with different settings.

That's a good point:  there's no reason to use sync if you want or need different settings on various machines.  When sync comes in handy, however, is when you use the same settings and the same sites, over and over again, on different machines -- which is what happens in my house.

For mrs.perknh and me, sync has been nothing short of a godsend.  Still, I'm glad to hear you say you don't consider sync to be a security or a privacy concern.  I don't either, but I believe many worry about privacy and security when considering using sync for a browser even though those very same people are using syncing services all of the time without giving it a second thought.   Email or Facebook or YouTube, or any other number of sites, come to mind when I think of sync.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 15, 2019, 05:31:57 pm
Why does this topic exist ? .. we all know the answer is FIREFOX :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 15, 2019, 05:54:11 pm
Why does this topic exist ? .. we all know the answer is FIREFOX :)

 :)


Now I have a question for you?  Do you think Firefox encrypts our synced data as well as Chromium and Chrome encrypts its users synced data?

This is what Chromium says:

Quote
Encryption options

For added security, Chromium will encrypt your data.
To change this setting, reset sync to remove your sync passphrase
Encrypt synced passwords with your Google username and password
Data was encrypted with your sync passphrase on *******. This doesn't include payment methods and addresses from Google Pay.

Firefox isn't as clear as Chromium and Chrome when it talks about encrypting data.  In fact, I haven't heard much about it.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 15, 2019, 06:13:31 pm
https://medium.com/mozilla-tech/how-firefox-sync-keeps-your-secrets-if-tls-fails-14420d45885c
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 16, 2019, 06:59:26 am
Thank you, PCNetSpec. :)

And here's a quote from a link found from within the article:

Quote
...The new Firefox Sync is the first service to use Firefox Accounts. The security goals remain the same: there is still a strong random secret key, and Mozilla’s servers cannot decrypt your data. However, instead of using pairing, a “wrapped” version of your secret key, protected by your password, is stored alongside your Firefox Account. This means you can recover all your data, even if you lose all your devices at the same time. Setting up a new device only requires typing your Firefox Account email and password into it.

This is a significant change from the previous Firefox Sync. The security of your data now depends upon your password. If your password is guessable, somebody else could connect to your account and decrypt your data. Of course, the best passwords are randomly generated.

Source:  https://blog.mozilla.org/services/2014/04/30/firefox-syncs-new-security-model/

Mozilla is counting on its users to have a good password* when they use its sync service, but the new Firefox Sync is clearly very secure and private.  This thread within Peppermint forum ought to give anyone peace of mind who is considering using Firefox Sync.


* I happen to like passphrases more then passwords -- because I can remember them!   That said, I've been very happy using open source Bitwarden password manager within Firefox and Chromium (I moved away from LastPass because it isn't open source).  Bitwarden has an excellent builtin password generator, and you can keep secure notes within it too! ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: dullblade2 on February 17, 2019, 03:57:03 pm
       thanks for the discussion.   :) This is  one report I encountered about browser security.  It also contains a tool but I did not light up the tool.

I have not evaluated much in it.  I used to spend an entirely unreasonable amount of time chasing down and surveying different articles  on security when I used M$ and it was one of the reasons I migrated to linux.   I may or may not try to understand any of it, but it seems to be on the level. I really do not want to go down that rabbit hole or become too paranoid about it.  But I provide it to the community if anyone else is interested.
I got to the report below from here:   webpage is dated January 21, 2019
1. https://www.securityweek.com/websites-can-exploit-browser-extensions-steal-user-data (https://www.securityweek.com/websites-can-exploit-browser-extensions-steal-user-data)

 
This is the author and link to the report itself: Dolière Francis Somé from the Université Côte d'Azur, Inria, France,
2. http://www-sop.inria.fr/members/Doliere.Some/empoweb/ (http://www-sop.inria.fr/members/Doliere.Some/empoweb/) or    (PDF (https://www-sop.inria.fr/members/Doliere.Some/papers/empoweb.pdf))
    The paper (http://www-sop.inria.fr/members/Doliere.Some/papers/empoweb.pdf) has more. In particular it shows case studies, discusses countermeasures, etc.       We have also recorded some videos (http://www-sop.inria.fr/members/Doliere.Some/empoweb/extensions/) demonstrating how we managed to exploit those extensions             
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 17, 2019, 06:56:28 pm
Yeah, you're point is well-taken, extensions can be a risk factor.

Check this out:

Kerckhoffs's principle

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kerckhoffs%27s_principle

Password encryption in Yandex Browser

https://yandex.com/support/browser-passwords-crypto/


In my case I'm making an assumption that Bitwarden's password manager is secure since it's it's business to keep our passwords secure.  I'm also making the assumption that because it's open source, those with the know-how can read its code (unlike with LastPass which is a proprietary password manager) and report any bugs they find.  But, you're right, every time you add any extension to your browser's toolkit, you're opening yourself up to more potential risk.  Here (https://www.networkworld.com/article/3183675/security/stop-using-password-manager-browser-extensions.html) is a strong argument (countering mine!) for not using a third-party password manager.

Right this moment I'm writing this from an extension-free, Nightly Web Browser from Mozilla.  And all ll I know for sure is this:  I'm getting to watch a lot more cool ads over and over again when I don't have uBlock Origin up and running. :D
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: dullblade2 on February 18, 2019, 09:52:07 am
 :) thank you, perknh.  Security is such a thorny issue in general, not many folks even want to discuss it.  Like stepping off the edge of the continental shelf, off the eastern edge of the Atlantic coast, it gets very deep very quickly.  I looked at/scanned Kerckhoffs's principle- and I agree that an open-source pw manager is probably better than a proprietary one.  I usually do not use much in the way of extensions in FF, I am also 'assuming' and trusting that FF has it basically covered.     

I have respected Bruce Schneier for a long time and have found other good folks to listen to, but unless you are a full time security person, it is easy just to throw up your hands and just hope and pray.  I do Simple things like: do not click on random links out of curiosity, stay updated, maybe re-install your OS once in a while,,,,,but I am not yet versed in the use of VPNs, the Tor browser, and stuff like that.   As I say most of us find it painful even to think about.     

 If one follows the big news stories about Huawei, Cambridge Analytica, FB, etc., we probably face more threats just using mobile phones-which phone home (Huawei), FB (which mines and milks anything you post), and the big aggregator companies which collect personal info across a wide array of places until they know more about you than you know about you.  Thanks for your input.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 23, 2019, 09:26:02 pm
Why in the world does Chromium/Chrome still not have a master password option for its own password manager?  Firefox gives its users the option to protect their passwords with a master password.  Why can't Chromium and Chrome do the same.  I've now tried Firefox's master password option and it works just fine.

Admittedly we can have stronger passwords if we do make use of Chromium's/Chrome's default password manager than if we don't, but I don't get why Google won't add a master password option to its password manager.  Does Blair's argument below from December 2008 still hold water?

Is Blair right when he says "that it [a master password] creates a false sense of security instead of actually providing a strong security benefit"?  Wouldn't having the option to have a master password be better than not having the option?  I just don't get Google's logic here, even though I know that Google (on most things) is pretty darn smart.


Quote
Blair (Googler) said:
Hi everybody,

We understand that many of you want a master password for your saved passwords in Google Chrome.  You’ve laid out many scenarios in which this might be useful, but the most common is that if your computer were to fall into the wrong hands, that person would then have access to your saved passwords.

While we agree that this situation would be terrible, we believe that a master password would not sufficiently protect you from danger. Someone with physical access to your computer could install a keylogger to steal your passwords or go to the sites where your passwords are stored and get them from the automatically filled-in password fields. A master password required to show saved passwords would not prevent these outcomes.

Currently, the best method for protecting your saved passwords is to lock your computer whenever you step away from it, even for a short period of time.  We encrypt your saved passwords on your hard disk. To access these passwords, someone would either need to log in as you or circumvent the encryption.

We know this is a long-standing issue, and we see where you're coming from. Please know that your security is our highest priority, and our decision not to implement the master password feature is based on our belief that it creates a false sense of security instead of actually providing a strong security benefit.

Best,
Blair

Source:  https://productforums.google.com/forum/?hl=en#!category-topic/chrome/give-feature-feedback-and-suggestions/k6JmRoGJp5w

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: dullblade2 on February 25, 2019, 12:45:42 pm
not real familiar with Chrome/Chromium, but I do not use a master pw in FF.  I seems to me to be better to have several levels of separate pw's, than to have only one.   

my pw  for this site and for other similar sites which do not give much access to personal info is not as critical as some other venues.  It seems to me the whole password thing needs to be worked out a little better.    I do not see the point of 4-digit pins for example.  I would think they could be easily cracked, having only 10,000 possible combos.
How about a thumb drive with a complicated hash value, you would plug in whenever you were signing in to an account or site ?   
I hate fingerprints and facial recognition too-don't want my hand or my head chopped off....
Being carjacked or abducted and taken to the ATM so the thieves/rapist murderers can force me to withdraw money is also not such a happy thought.  Fortunately that is pretty rare.   

I don't think there are any easy solutions until someone can think up a different way to log in to your machine, website, etc.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 25, 2019, 02:31:37 pm
not real familiar with Chrome/Chromium, but I do not use a master pw in FF.  I seems to me to be better to have several levels of separate pw's, than to have only one. 

I'm not sure that's quite how the master password works (?) .. I thought it was simply a password that is entered once per session, that unless entered would not allow access to the automatic entry of passwords, or the users ability to see saved passwords via the "Show Passwords" function in the Firefox preferences.

It's NOT a master password for all visited websites .. they still have individual passwords .. it just stops someone with local access to your PC being able to open Firefox and either view your stored passwords, or to visit a site on your PC and have the password auto-filled.

So it's more of an EXTRA security feature, not a REPLACEMENT for current passwords.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on February 25, 2019, 06:17:56 pm
Quote
I'm not sure that's quite how the master password works (?) .. I thought it was simply a password that is entered once per session, that unless entered would not allow access to the automatic entry of passwords, or the users ability to see saved passwords via the "Show Passwords" function in the Firefox preferences.

It's NOT a master password for all visited websites .. they still have individual passwords .. it just stops someone with local access to your PC being able to open Firefox and either view your stored passwords, or to visit a site on your PC and have the password auto-filled.

So it's more of an EXTRA security feature, not a REPLACEMENT for current passwords. -- PCNetSpec

That's it, PCNetSpec; that's exactly how it works.  But, if you have a good master password, all your other passwords are very well protected.

Google is pretty much making us completely sign in and out of sync and then remove all data off the computer unless we choose to use a third-party password manager (I like Bitwarden); OR, forgive the cynic in me, buy a personal Chromebook. 

Quote
Currently, the best method for protecting your saved passwords is to lock your computer whenever you step away from it, even for a short period of time.  We encrypt your saved passwords on your hard disk. To access these passwords, someone would either need to log in as you or circumvent the encryption. -- Blair (Googler)

Try doing the nonsense Blair is suggesting day in and day out when there's one computer used by lots of people... No way!  Google really could be a lot more helpful to its users by adding a master password option to its built-in password manager.  That one simple thing could save users a lot of grief.

However Firefox isn't entirely off the hook either,  the problem I see with Firefox is not with its excellent password manager, but with the difficulty or awkwardness one has in changing users, or user profiles/accounts easily.  In Chromium or Chrome, one can easily move from one user's profile, or account, to another.  I've yet to find an easy way to do the same with Firefox.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 26, 2019, 03:08:16 am
Yeah I'm afraid we're still a good way off Firefox having smooth user profile switching simply because of how it works (stores profiles) .. it's something we have to work around in ICE .. it can be done
https://www.howtogeek.com/209320/how-to-set-up-and-use-multiple-profiles-user-accounts-in-firefox/
but it's a long way off as smooth as Chrome .. that said, it's possibly/probably more secure as each profile is COMPLETELY isolated.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Mynaardt on February 26, 2019, 03:10:57 am
To get my own two cents worth in here, I've taken up to using both Vivaldi and Falkon as a matter of course.

Vivaldi, written by those who first wrote Opera, works just fine with google pages and such.  And does not use as much RAM as either Chromium or Firefox.

The main reason I use Falkon is because of the 2 GB RAM limitation on my netbook.  If I use Vivaldi, Chromium, or Firefox on that netbook, it runs painfully slow because of the RAM burden.  But Falkon uses way less RAM, which works out well on that one netbook.

I prefer all the features of Vivaldi.  Falkon, of course, lacks the same amount of bells and whistles.  But it works surprisingly well on most pages I've ever ever tried it on.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on February 26, 2019, 04:14:23 am
It's not just the browsers either .. the web itself has become a horribly unoptimised and bloated place to visit.

A by product of faster hardware appears to be sloppier software optimisation .. one heck of a waste if you ask me, you have to wonder how fast an i7 would actually appear if software were optimised to the same extent it was in say the 60's and 70's because it HAD to be.

Heck they landed on the moon with how little RAM and processing power ?
(the LEM wouldn't handle Youtube that's for sure)

I guess a counter argument might be there'd be WAY less programmers with that skill level and hence less (and/or more expensive) software .. but you still have to wonder how things COULD have been (or maybe that's just the grumpy old man in me) :)

Eventually no small footprint browser is going to help because a single simple webpage will be 2Gb+ requiring a 10Gbps broadband connection and an i9 to process ::)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: dullblade2 on February 26, 2019, 09:33:47 am
 
Quote
" it's more of an EXTRA security feature, not a REPLACEMENT for current passwords." -- PCNetSpec

@PCNetSpec- thank you for a better description of how the master pw works in FF.  The yubikey sounds like one solution, but a little pricey.


 it is also true that websites are huge bloated affairs now demanding big bandwidth to accomplish the same 1 or 2 second load times the less intensive websites many years ago used to demand.  5G is supposed to solve much of that if we (the western powers) can figure out whether to use huawei from China or nokia from Finland or the other one from Sweden to build out the network.

I would have to try 'Vivaldi and/or Falkon' to see how well they handle  memory.   I have heard that FF has some memory issues.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 02, 2019, 05:30:12 pm
Here's the updated and abbreviated conclusion from the article Best Browsers for Privacy by COMPUTERWORLD UK.  The ellipsis and the highlighted words are mine.

Quote
No browser can be guaranteed to be completely private. However, the best of the privacy-minded browsers promise to block ads and cookies and accommodate extensions that increase anonymity further.

There are a number of options out there, but here we take a look at the best browsers on the market for privacy.

Some companies that formerly made the list have now been removed to reflect new information. Namely, Yandex, Comodo and Cocoon because they are all proprietary and closed.

Opera was also sold in 2016 to a Chinese consortium and is now closed off and keeps users are in the dark about how the browser behaves.


Chrome features on our list but it's important to consider the following caveats: Chrome is owned by Google, and while it's based on the open source Chromium browser (also from Google), Google code means Google tracking. However, if you trust Google with your information there are ways to safeguard your browsing to a degree.

If you like Chrome there are 'de-Googled' options available like the Epic Privacy Browser (listed below) and Iridium Browser but it's hard to say if all the traces of Google are truly removed from top to bottom...

For most users, Firefox checks all the boxes. While it's by no means airtight, you can buttress it with add-ons that minimise online tracking.  Firefox and the stripped down Firefox Quantum both get our vote.

Source:  https://www.computerworlduk.com/galleries/applications/best-browsers-for-privacy-3628363/

Now, it's time for me to change the subject and eat some crow!

The master password manager found in Firefox -- which I talked about ad nauseam in previous posts -- is a Royal PITA when trying to apply it in real life.  It pops up all the time asking for the master password.  Two days of that nonsense was enough for me.  If you could time the darn thing to ask you for the password when you want ... Well, that would be different, but it's just too aggravating to use as is.  Either lock, or suspend, the computer when exiting it and use the your browser's builtin password manager without a master password (as Blair the Googler had suggested above), or use a third-party password manager (I'm still fond of Bitwarden) and don't use your browser's builtin password manager at all,
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on March 02, 2019, 06:08:46 pm
Trust but verify. I wouldn't trust that web site as far... well, you know.


(http://vindsl.com/images/Screenshot_2019-03-02_15:53:44.png)


I've been sitting on their site for about 10 minutes, and I'm connected to 255 other sites now, and counting.

And, none of them are tracking me across the web, right?   ::)

BTW, you can see the Peppermint Forums, off to the side. Only 3rd party site it's connecting me to is DDG.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 02, 2019, 10:21:51 pm
That's an interesting extension, VinDSL.   That's pretty darn cool.  :)

Now did you see the list of the various browsers?  Tor, Waterfox, Pale Moon, Chrome, Brave?  The article to me is like a doctor who smokes and then tells you to quit smoking.  His advice is sound even if he doesn't live up to it himself.

Opera is hands of China now, so Opera browser is no longer under the protection of Norway's privacy laws.  Yandex is slipping too.  I dropped my accounts with Yandex a couple days ago.  But I could see the Russian people do not have easy access to the news like we do.  Their Yandex Zen program shows one picture of Donald Trump with Kim Jong-un.  That's about it for world news.  Other articles in Yandex Zen show pictures of Jennifer Lopez and Rihanna.  Yeah, they're pop divas/mamacitas for sure, but I don't really consider their pictures to be news.  Six years and Yandex browser for Linux is still in beta.  You download it and it scoops up all of your bookmarks from your default browser without even asking.  That's too aggressive for me.  You can't use a standard authenticator app with Yandex for 2FA either.  You have to use Yandex's own authenticator app.  It's a one way street with Yandex.  And woe be to you if you close out your accounts in the wrong order.  If you do that, you'll be stuck with one account you won't be able to close at all.  And to restart a Yandex account, you have to give them an email address of somebody you've emailed before -- luckily for me I could give them myself.  Phew! 

I'm now convinced, from personal experience with Maxthon, Opera, and Yandex, that it's no good running software from companies who are operating under authoritarian regimes.  By our Western standards (which admittedly are slipping), they're not up to snuff in regards to privacy, or internationally recognized standards.  I'm thinking of China's phobia with https (the Chinese government hates it), or Yandex's kooky software behaviors that other browsers and apps created elsewhere would never consider doing.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on March 02, 2019, 11:03:53 pm
Now did you see the list of the various browsers?  Tor, Waterfox, Pale Moon, Chrome, Brave?

I'm using five (5) browsers, on this machine, for different purposes. They all have their strengths and weaknesses.

I don't think any of them are secure, personally. That said, it's fun to play hide n' seek using them  :P


Let's see... I just checked an IP addy site. ipaddress.com thinks I'm in the middle of a  fiord  in Sweden.


(http://vindsl.com/images/Opera Snapshot_2019-03-02_204033_77.111.246.139.ipaddress.com.png)


And, Waze thinks I'm parked at a greenbelt in Kiev.


(http://vindsl.com/images/Opera Snapshot_2019-03-02_204934_www.waze.com.png)


That's good enough for me. I'm sticking with what I got, until they home in. Then, I'll switch positions...  LoL

I sent a Tweet to the missus, in the other room, a few minutes ago. Twitter sent her a 'suspicious activity' notification.

BTW, the trick is to know when to lower your shields, so Google, PayPal, and so forth don't lock your accounts.

What an era we're living through, eh what? It's like a Mad Magazine 'Spy vs Spy' cartoon.

Here ya go, perk. Log into YT and watch a few of these: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCvDO6ezkGl8mH4r4KA1Qo0Q

That'll throw them off your scent...  8)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on March 03, 2019, 01:12:28 am
Gotta remember to install Brave on this phone, and Bing for searching.

Sent from my Moto X4 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 03, 2019, 07:24:19 am
BTW, the trick is to know when to lower your shields, so Google, PayPal, and so forth don't lock your accounts.

I remember getting locked out of Amazon once when I was using Opera's proxy.

Here ya go, perk. Log into YT and watch a few of these: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCvDO6ezkGl8mH4r4KA1Qo0Q

That'll throw them off your scent...  8)

 ;D

Gotta remember to install Brave on this phone, and Bing for searching.

Bing?  Not Startpage or SearX?  What's your thinking here, VinDSL?  Microsoft's tracking rivals the worst of them -- and I know you know that. :-\
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on March 03, 2019, 03:44:42 pm
Bing?  Not Startpage or SearX?  What's your thinking here, VinDSL?  Microsoft's tracking rivals the worst of them -- and I know you know that. :-\

Remember, I'm talking about smarties now, AKA personal tracking devices, not PCs...  ;)

Google’s search results are highly biased, based on your personal browsing habits, and optimized for your location. Their AI sends me results in French, Russian, Turkish, Swedish, and sometimes English. I don't have time to mess around with this nonsense, when I'm working with a 5.5" mobile screen. Plus, Google gives one the results propaganda THEY want you to see - not necessarily the ones you're searching for.

Google took a perfectly good search engine, that produced organic results, and wrecked it with negative suggestions consistent their THEIR own corporate biases and political agenda .

Microsoft's Bing hasn't followed them down the Primrose path, yet. When they do, I'll switch to another search engine.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 03, 2019, 04:24:31 pm
Remember, I'm talking about smarties now, AKA personal tracking devices, not PCs...  ;)

Yes, I too have a personal tracking device that's running Brave!  ;D

You supposedly can turn off private results from Google search from within Google's search settings.  I've done so, although I can't tell you how well turning it off works.  I don't use Google search a lot, though it's tough to get away from it entirely.

I should correct myself, VinDSL.  I know Outlook mail tracks you like mad. (I have an Outlook account for Skype.)  I'm assuming Bing search tracks the same way Outlook does, but, honestly, I'm not 100% certain that it does.   Fortunately Brave browser for a smartphone gives its users lots of options regarding search. :)

Settings for Google Search (https://www.google.com/preferences?hl=en)

If, and only if, you're signed into your Google account, look for:

Quote
Private results
Private results help find more relevant content for you, including content and connections that only you can see.
Use private results
Do not use private results

And choose Do not use private results  I guess you won't be able to turn off the bias if you're not signed into Google. ::)

Thanks, VinDSL.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 06, 2019, 07:45:09 am
One of the things I don't like about Chromium browser within an Ubuntu-based distribution is Ubuntu granting itself full access to a user's Google account.  If a third-party app has to grant itself full access to my Google account, I'd rather that app be Google Chrome than Ubuntu.  After all Google Chrome is a Google browser!  Although I've looked and looked online, I've yet to find a reasonable explanation as to why Ubuntu needs full access to a user's Google account. 

It should be noted, to its credit, Mozilla Firefox doesn't grant itself full access to a user's Google account. ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on March 06, 2019, 07:48:00 am
Can you explain that perknh .. how is Ubuntu getting full access to your Google account ?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 06, 2019, 08:12:28 am
Can you explain that perknh .. how is Ubuntu getting full access to your Google account ?

Yes!

1) First you need to install Chromium-browser.

2) Now sign into your Google account.  (I sync everything, but probably signing into Gmail would be enough.)

3) Click onto your personal icon and go to Google Account.  You'll see a welcome screen, and on the left side of the screen will be a list of options.

4) Click onto the option called Security.

5) Now, scroll down the page.  Next to Your devices will be Google apps with account access

As you'll soon see, Ubuntu will be listed as having full access to your Google account. :o

Here (https://askubuntu.com/questions/989359/why-has-the-ubuntu-app-full-access-to-my-google-account#989373) is a popular explanation as to why this is happening.  But, honestly, this explanation doesn't satisfy me.  Maybe it should satisfy me, but it doesn't. :-\



Thank you, PCNetSpec.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on March 06, 2019, 08:32:17 am
@ Zeb

Any chance you can ask Alan Pope what this is all about ? .. is there some reason this MUST be done this way (say to even get it compiled in the first place) ?

Because if not I'm wondering whether we should go to the lengths of compiling it ourselves and removing that .. even though we don't ship with Chromium anyway.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on March 06, 2019, 11:13:37 am
Yet another reason NOT to use a browser named after a poisonous metal  :D

Joke aside, seems to be somewhat fishy... the comment saying, if you install it on fedora, it gives fedora access  :o
If you want, I could install it on Void to see if it happens there also. Void devs tend to clean-up packages from 'unnecessary' features.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on March 06, 2019, 01:15:56 pm
Hmmm... is this related to my discovery that my motherboard thinks ubuntu is my default boot device?

 :-\

Also, following @perknh's directions above i find that the access given ubuntu is http:// not https://
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on March 06, 2019, 01:47:30 pm
Hmm...
I wonder if its possible to remove it?!

Here's on Void  :o
(sorry, in Swedish, but you get the picture)

(https://i.imgur.com/ziaWL23.png)

chromium purged from system  :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on March 06, 2019, 02:52:22 pm
Heh. Are you starting to see why I use different browsers for different things, perk?

An example is:  When I was into SEO, I used Google Chrome as an optimization tool, when I was developing new web pages. I gave Chrome full unfettered access to everywhere I was going, and everything I was doing, when I was admin'ing my sites. It was a ploy to sucker Google meta bots into following me into the inner sanctum, and crawling my sites.

Many times, new web pages links would come up in the Google Search results, before they went live, e.g.  while I was developing them - before they were available for public viewing. For monkey business and general browsing, I used Fx, locked-down with tight settings and security add-ons.

I guess what I'm saying is, keep 'em guessing. Using multiple disparate browsers, setup in different ways, for different purposes. It really messes with AI.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on March 06, 2019, 03:55:05 pm
Hmmm... is this related to my discovery that my motherboard thinks ubuntu is my default boot device?

No, that's because on UEFI systems we use the Ubuntu signed bootloader.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on March 06, 2019, 03:57:16 pm
Here's on Void  :o
(sorry, in Swedish, but you get the picture)

Erm no, I don't get the picture .. nor can I copy paste text from a picture into Google translate to figure it out :-\
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on March 06, 2019, 04:15:00 pm
Ok... its basically the same.
"Void linux chromium has full access to you Google account"

The same as perknh is seeing and the screenshots from Ubuntu or Fedora on the thread he linked to.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on March 06, 2019, 06:05:42 pm
Thanks pin

Something tells me this is a misunderstanding of what's actually going on here. I can't see that all those distros would actively seek access to your Google account, I mean why would they, it could destroy their reputation ?

If I had to guess - I'd guess compiling asks for a name/url during the build .. and it's just saying "Chromium has full access to your Google account" (which you'd expect) .. but since they added their name/url during the build it now says "VOID Linux Chromium has full access to your Google account" .. in other words it's not that the VOID Linux devs have access to your Google account, it's just that Chromium itself does but Chromium is now called VOID Linux Chromium on your system.

Did that make sense ?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 06, 2019, 09:52:26 pm
Thanks pin

Something tells me this is a misunderstanding of what's actually going on here. I can't see that all those distros would actively seek access to your Google account, I mean why would they, it could destroy their reputation ?

If I had to guess - I'd guess compiling asks for a name/url during the build .. and it's just saying "Chromium has full access to your Google account" (which you'd expect) .. but since they added their name/url during the build it now says "VOID Linux Chromium has full access to your Google account" .. in other words it's not that the VOID Linux devs have access to your Google account, it's just that Chromium itself does but Chromium is now called VOID Linux Chromium on your system.

Did that make sense ?

So, PCNetSpec, are we assuming Ubuntu is misnaming Chromium browser by naming it Ubuntu when it compiles Chromium browser? 

Or is it as this this (https://askubuntu.com/questions/915556/ubuntu-17-04-chromium-browser-quietly-provides-full-access-to-google-account) link suggests, -- an error on Chromium's part? 

Below is from mrs.perknh's Google Chrome account:

Quote
Google apps with account access
These are trusted apps by Google you installed on your devices. Remove any that you no longer use.

Google Chrome
Has full access to your Google Account

Now, in my case using Chromium (actually I uninstalled Chromium after I began wondering about this and am now using Firefox and Google Chrome beta), might the notification actually been telling me the truth -- that Ubuntu really did have full access to my Google account?   Absurd as it sounds, might the message have been correct, even if it's just a strange ongoing glitch (bug) within Ubuntu of some sort?  I mean we have no difficulty at all believing that Google Chrome has full access to mrs.perknh's Google account.  I don't think anyone doubts that.  Now if we believe one message, why not believe the other -- that when running Chromium browser from within an Ubuntu-based distribution, Ubuntu will have full access to our Google accounts?

It sounds crazy, doesn't it?  But that's what it says.


@pin

Quote
Yet another reason NOT to use a browser named after a poisonous metal  :D
-- pin

Good one, pin! ;D



@VinDSL
Quote
Heh. Are you starting to see why I use different browsers for different things, perk?
-- VinDSL

Yep, I sure do. ;)



@PCNetSpec, zebedeeboss, pin, spence, and VinDSL, thank you all. This is a strange thing indeed.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on March 06, 2019, 10:21:32 pm
Might find this interesting, perk - it should all be in English, for you:   :D

https://productforums.google.com/forum/#!topic/chrome/DsbPuYYTHzo
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on March 06, 2019, 11:45:41 pm
Thanks pin

Something tells me this is a misunderstanding of what's actually going on here. I can't see that all those distros would actively seek access to your Google account, I mean why would they, it could destroy their reputation ?

If I had to guess - I'd guess compiling asks for a name/url during the build .. and it's just saying "Chromium has full access to your Google account" (which you'd expect) .. but since they added their name/url during the build it now says "VOID Linux Chromium has full access to your Google account" .. in other words it's not that the VOID Linux devs have access to your Google account, it's just that Chromium itself does but Chromium is now called VOID Linux Chromium on your system.

Did that make sense ?

Yes, I had the same thought... had a look at the package build script and saw this...
Code: [Select]
	# Google API keys (see http://www.chromium.org/developers/how-tos/api-keys)
# Note: These are for Void Linux use ONLY.
conf+=(
'google_api_key="AIzaSyA9gWazKaHaNIPPg2hrMj6_ZSG8AFmq738"'

Quoting from http://www.chromium.org/developers/how-tos/api-keys
"Some features of Chromium use Google APIs, and to access those APIs, either an API Key or a set of OAuth 2.0 tokens is required. Setting up API keys is optional. If you don't do it, the specific APIs using Google services won't work in your custom build, but all other features will run normally."
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 07, 2019, 06:11:58 am
Might find this interesting, perk - it should all be in English, for you:   :D

https://productforums.google.com/forum/#!topic/chrome/DsbPuYYTHzo

Quote
Well, the phrase "full account access" might cause some misunderstanding. What it means is that anyone who can use your Chrome can access your Google account information like gmail, hangouts, etc. which basically means everything. It is not saying your Chrome will do something to your Google account without your consent.

-- Rong Jie

Good find, VinDSL!  This would mean that anyone who has access to this local Ubuntu-based distribution (Peppermint) has access to my Google account.  That would make sense, and I could live with that.  Problem is, that isn't what it says.  I mean take my cell phone as an example; I've given What'sApp permission to have access to my Google contacts and it has access to pretty much my entire device.  But I never gave Ubuntu permission to access my Google account -- just like I never gave Firefox permission. However, Firefox doesn't say it has full access to my Google Account, while Ubuntu does say it does (or did, because I purged Chromium yesterday.)

I should say, I don't mind Google Chrome having full access to my Google account if I'm using Google Chrome.  However, I would mind Google Chrome having full access to my Outlook account if I was using Google Chrome.

@PCNetSpec

I slept on this -- perhaps waking up with a clue for you.

My Chromium account had both me and mrs.perknh as users.  However my wife rarely used Chromium because she has her own Chrome browser.  So I forgot she was attached to the Chromium account.  I deleted all my info, but I forgot to delete hers before I removed and purged Chromium.  After this, the purging, when I went into her Chrome account, it then said that Ubuntu had full access to her account and that Google Chrome had full access to her account.  I then removed Ubuntu's access and it hasn't come back.  Maybe that's clue that can help you with your understanding of this matter.

PCNetSpec, just a note:  I don't think zeb has ever participated in this thread.  He may not have gotten your message yesterday. :-\
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on March 07, 2019, 07:07:49 am
Okay, remember this
https://mashable.com/article/google-chrome-69-forced-login/?europe=true#Y8fM2E1S4aqn
?

So it looks like your local copy of the Chrome web browser (which is based on Chromium, so Chromium probably does this too) needs full access to your Google account to log you into all the other Google services when you log into say GMail (or any other single Google service).

Now I'm connecting the dots a bit here (along with the response VinDSL linked to) - a bog standard copy of Chromium would likely state "Chromium has full access to your Google account", but the naming convention when it's compiled by someone else makes it read "<insert distro name here> Chromium has full access to your Google account", but it's still just talking about YOUR LOCAL COPY of Chromium and not that the distro devs themselves have access to your Google account.
(and that Ubuntu have just been stupid in their naming of their Chromium build so it says "Ubuntu" rather than "Ubuntu Chromium" .. as all other distros seem to)

In any case you need to draw a line of trust somewhere .. i mean it would be VERY easy for Ubuntu/Void/Peppermint/etc. to say push an update that contained a script that copied your home folder contents back to them. The problem with this is that (at least in the case of Ubuntu and Peppermint .. in fact even more so Peppermint because we ONLY use launchpad where code MUST be uploaded as source) by their own enforced open sourcing of code policy this would be quickly spotted and would destroy their reputation.

So in the absence of evidence to the contrary, and on trust earned by Linux developers over many years, I'm going to read that as "Your Local Copy Of Chromium (which was compiled by Ubuntu, and by the way here is their URL) has full access to your Google account".
(which is NOT the same as saying Ubuntu as an entity have access to your Google account)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 07, 2019, 11:55:48 am
Quote
(...Ubuntu have just been stupid in their naming of their Chromium build so it says "Ubuntu" rather than "Ubuntu Chromium" .. as all other distros seem to)
-- PCNetSpec

Thank you, PCNetSpec.  Truth is Peppermint, Chromium, and even Google have all been very, VERY good to me over the years.  Two calendar years ago, Peppermint 8 was a work horse for me and I did all of my work through Peppermint, Chromium and Google's services.  But recently, when I began to contrast mrs.perknh's security notifications within her Google account (using Chrome) with mine (using Chromium), my antennas went up. 

Bottom line:  Chromium browser, although poorly named within Peppermint and Ubuntu, is a safe browser to use.  :)

Thanks so much for looking into this.  And thank you also to all the others here who have posted about this topic too.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on March 07, 2019, 12:17:00 pm
Quote
Bottom line:  Chromium browser, although poorly named within Peppermint and Ubuntu, is a safe browser to use.  :)

 :D  :D
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on March 07, 2019, 12:30:41 pm
Meanwhile... today whilst helping someone triage an issue over on MeWe, I decided to install Vivaldi for the first time as that's the user's preferred browser. made a 3rd MeWe SSB with Vivaldi, what a slow pile of molasses that is. Now to figure out how to access it's settings...

 >:(    :-\
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 07, 2019, 12:36:34 pm
Quote
Bottom line:  Chromium browser, although poorly named within Peppermint and Ubuntu, is a safe browser to use.  :)

 :D  :D

How's this:  Chromium browser, although poorly named within Peppermint and Ubuntu, is a safe browser to use -- I HOPE! :-X

Is that better? ;D



@spence

Quote
Meanwhile... today whilst helping someone triage an issue over on MeWe, I decided to install Vivaldi for the first time as that's the user's preferred browser. made a 3rd MeWe SSB with Vivaldi, what a slow pile of molasses that is. Now to figure out how to access it's settings...

 >:(    :-\

-- spence

Top left corner (the menu), if my memory is serving me correctly. :-\ 
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on March 07, 2019, 12:57:48 pm
Top left corner (the menu), if my memory is serving me correctly. :-\ 

True in the basic browser perk, but not when it's an SSB...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 07, 2019, 01:10:19 pm
Quote
True in the basic browser perk, but not when it's an SSB... -- spence

Sorry, spence.  That I do not know.  I haven't used ICE in ages. :-\
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: pin on March 07, 2019, 01:54:52 pm
@perknh

Sorry, I just found it funny.
Safe? Most probably. But, for sure it 'calls home' to 'master' Google.
On the other hand, is there such a thing as privacy these days?!  :-\
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 07, 2019, 03:01:27 pm
@perknh

Sorry, I just found it funny.
Safe? Most probably. But, for sure it 'calls home' to 'master' Google.
On the other hand, is there such a thing as privacy these days?!  :-\

I enjoyed you comment, pin.  It was a good one! :)

Some time ago I had to do some serous soul searching as to who I thought would do the best job of keeping my family's data SAFE.  I opted for Linux and Peppermint and Chromium and Google's services.  So far, knock on wood, this approach has worked fine for us, but, again, I knock on wood.  Please note, I had little to nothing to do with Microsoft and Windows. ;)

Now, if I had to evaluate my choices over again, I'd probably choose Firefox Quantum or Google Chrome over Chromium.  And, of course, I'd stay with Peppermint.   


@pin & VinDSL

I do agree with VinDSL that one protects one's identity best (from all but our ISPs) by regularly switching browsers.  My problem with browsers these days (and this is just my opinion), is that a few of these browsers are going south, or getting worse, quite quickly.  For instance, I don't like losing the protections of Norway's privacy laws by moving data privacy protections to Singapore.  To me, this is a step in the wrong direction.  Even though this move helps Opera dodge EU's stronger privacy regulations, it doesn't help its users much.   See here (https://iapp.org/news/a/gdpr-matchup-singapores-personal-data-protection-act/).  Grr!

Also Yandex has found itself within a bind since it has become more and more under some kind of neo-Tsarist/authoritarian oversight.  Undoubtedly Yandex is world-class company, but I don't believe the Russian government is doing Yandex any favors these days.  Before Yandex's philosophy was more or less "If you don't mess with us, we won't mess with you."  Unfortunately, I don't believe Yandex can afford to be such a gentle player anymore.

Then we had Maxthon.  Believe it or not, for a brief window in time, Maxthon was the best browser I ever used in LInux, but then Chinese leaders and Chinese data regulations changed.  And soon thereafter Maxthon for Linux went belly up.  Why did it die off?  I believe Maxthon for Linux died off because it couldn't open up its source code without raising the ire of the Chinese authorities and/or the open source community.  It had to die off.  I could be wrong about this, but I really don't think so.

So where does this leave us?  I believe our best bets for good and secure browsers are now with Firefox, Chromium, Chrome, Brave and Vivaldi.  That's about it.  I haven't had enough experience with Iridium, Pale Moon, Balsilisk, or Iron to comment upon those browsers at present.  I would imagine they're all pretty good too -- even if they're a little behind with code development (as is Chromium at times).
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on March 07, 2019, 03:45:41 pm
@spence

If you used the stock version of ICE that's included with Peppermint at the moment .. all settings that apply to a main Vivaldi browser session also applies to ALL Vivaldi SSB's (because they all use the same standard profile).

So any changes you make to the normal Vivaldi window such as plugins, etc. also apply to ALL Vivaldi SSB's.

There is ONLY profile separation in Firefox SSB's .. though this will change in the next version of ICE
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on March 07, 2019, 05:33:44 pm
Quote
True in the basic browser perk, but not when it's an SSB... -- spence

Sorry, spence.  That I do not know.  I haven't used ICE in ages. :-\

Sorta curious, given your level of safety and security anxiety studiousness, I figured you'd appreciate opening every web application in the isolated containers a Firefox SSB creates. Effectively each SSB is blocking websites from following you around the web. If I understand this and PCNetSpec's explanations all correctly? Meanwhile, my hubster's of the mind that they have everything on us already and he can't be too overly concerned. In our case that means Putin knows everything too, for they have a long conjoined history.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 07, 2019, 09:10:53 pm
Sorta curious, given your level of safety and security anxiety studiousness, I figured you'd appreciate opening every web application in the isolated containers a Firefox SSB creates. Effectively each SSB is blocking websites from following you around the web. If I understand this and PCNetSpec's explanations all correctly?

No, you're onto something here, spence.  I think anxiety's a good word -- along with a healthy dose of pessimism (https://forum.peppermintos.com/index.php/topic,1469.msg13348.html#msg13348)!   You know maybe I should start using SSBs again.  I mean, this is Peppermint.  If we're going to use an SSB anywhere, Peppermint is the place.  ;)


Meanwhile, my hubster's of the mind that they have everything on us already and he can't be too overly concerned. In our case that means Putin knows everything too, for they have a long conjoined history.[/color]

I hear that argument quite frequently, spence:  it's usually from pessimists!  ;D   But seriously, what are his thoughts concerning Yandex search or Yandex browser today as compared to a half dozen years ago?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: spence on March 11, 2019, 12:34:41 pm
Hubster wouldn't touch any browser outta China nor Russia perknh... Knowing they may write all the most warm and fuzzy language into their policies, but their laws & policies are whatever the people in power tell the web providers they are on any given day. "Today we scour all traffic from Yekaterinburg and San Francisco because xyz enemy of Putin are there today" Honestly... just don't bother. Russia is set to close the borders of it's internet, Hubster is watching the protests there.  
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on March 11, 2019, 03:30:51 pm
Hubster wouldn't touch any browser outta China nor Russia perknh... Knowing they may write all the most warm and fuzzy language into their policies, but their laws & policies are whatever the people in power tell the web providers they are on any given day. "Today we scour all traffic from Yekaterinburg and San Francisco because xyz enemy of Putin are there today"

Thank you, spence.   


Honestly... just don't bother. Russia is set to close the borders of it's internet, Hubster is watching the protests there.

Yes, after watching how things have been developing there on my own, I decided recently to drop my accounts from there.  Then, a couple days after doing so , I read that about Mr. P's intention/aspiration to close off (or to be able to close off) Russia's Internet completely from the outside world. 

Thanks, but no thanks.  There's no way I want to go down that rabbit hole. ::)

I hate seeing the world balkanizing itself into various Web spaces, but that's exactly what's happening now.   Balkanizing cyberspace destroys the entire concept of the World Wide Web.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on June 18, 2019, 07:26:30 am
I've been monitoring bot activity lately, using Fx. As a consequence, I leave Fx running for days at a time, listening/watching Dubtrack.fm (https://www.dubtrack.fm/join/horizon).

I've noticed, at certain times, and under some circumstances (which I haven't fully patterned yet) Fx goes crazy and chews up all my RAM (16 GB).

Thank you Conky, for warning me, before it brings down my whole machine.

Also, I've noticed, when I shutdown Fx, it doesn't release the mem. RAM remains locked.

Fx's "Web Content" is always my top process - it doesn't go away, when I close Fx - and RAM never recovers.

The only way I've found to kill Fx's RAM hungry "Web Content" is to close Fx, and pipe the following commands in CLI:

Code: [Select]
for ch_id in `ps -ef | grep "firefox -contentproc" --color=never | awk ' { t = $1; $1 = $3; $3 = t; print; } ' | grep "^1" --color=never | awk '{print$2}'`; do kill -9 $ch_id ; done

Then, I restart Fx, and it's good until the next time.

Stripping processes, using uBlock Origin and  NoScript, has no effect on Web Content's never ceasing RAM appetite.

Just saying...  8)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on June 18, 2019, 08:52:01 am
Well that's the very definition of a memory leak.

Can't say I've noticed it, but I probably haven't run Fx for days on end  since Fx 67 came out.

It'll make a change for Fx to have a memory leak instead of Chrome :)

Are you still using nightly ?

And you haven't toggled gfx.webrender.all to true have you ? .. IIRC WebRender was supposed to leak at one point.



[EDIT]

Maybe try lowering the content process limit:
https://blog.pcrisk.com/windows/12867-firefox-uses-too-much-memory

As a web search suggests not everyone gets memory leaks in Fx, it may be connected with hardware acceleration, other system drivers/hardware, or specific addons.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on June 18, 2019, 01:51:26 pm
I'm on the trot right now, Chief. I'll revisit this thread when I get back.


  Sent from my Android One Moto X4 using Tapatalk

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on June 18, 2019, 02:23:11 pm
They made a lot of changes to memory management in Fx 67 .. it's possible they screwed up somewhere :(

[EDIT]

And were too busy with their other recent faux pas to notice ::)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on June 19, 2019, 07:15:07 pm
Got back late, yesterday - just in time to find out about the Zero-Day in Fx (https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/security/advisories/mfsa2019-18/). I didn't feel like running around looking for a patched ver, at that late hour - which BTW, I installed this afternoon.

Well that's the very definition of a memory leak.

Correctamundo

Are you still using nightly ?

это не так

And you haven't toggled gfx.webrender.all to true have you ? .. IIRC WebRender was supposed to leak at one point.

Nope. I pretty much leave Fx alone. I just changed a couple of things that made me want to throw a shoe through the monitor.

Maybe try lowering the content process limit:
https://blog.pcrisk.com/windows/12867-firefox-uses-too-much-memory

As a web search suggests not everyone gets memory leaks in Fx, it may be connected with hardware acceleration, other system drivers/hardware, or specific addons.

Here's the commit, for the Fx update that I just did:

Code: [Select]
Commit Log for Wed Jun 19 15:35:47 2019

firefox (67.0.2+build2-0ubuntu0.18.04.1) to 67.0.3+build1-0ubuntu0.18.04.1
firefox-locale-en (67.0.2+build2-0ubuntu0.18.04.1) to 67.0.3+build1-0ubuntu0.18.04.1
firefox-locale-ru (67.0.2+build2-0ubuntu0.18.04.1) to 67.0.3+build1-0ubuntu0.18.04.1
I'll keep an eye on the update, and see if that helps. Maybe someone was trying to haxor me with the zero-day exploit  ;D
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: adminmike on June 22, 2019, 03:00:02 am
Why in Pepper Mint will not install the Pale Moon browser by default? It is the best. ::)

I recommend, pay attention - http://www.palemoon.org/
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: clatterfordslim on June 22, 2019, 04:41:02 am
(not to mention Opera, but that one is a bit less obvious)

I don't know I've got Opera going and WhatsApp is built in, to get WhatsApp running, all you have to do is follow the instructions and Bobs your Uncle, Fannies your Duck you're up and running messaging away. I use WhatsApp for work, we have our own dedicated encrypted chat. It works here in Peppermint flawlessly. Have not tried the limitless VPN yet though, as my default browser I still use Firefox. Firefox for me is still the most secure browser and plus it's come along leaps and bounds, over the years. Chrome is good and snappy, just fed up of it saving everything and having to always clear it out. My Android phone is the same, forever saving where I've been on the Internet, what I've typed in the search. Let alone having to make sure everything is closed down after use because it'll slow to a halt. As much as I like Android wish it would stay up to date. My poor Samsung Galaxy Young 2 is running 4.4 of Android or something like that, could do with a new phone as the onscreen keyboard is way too small.  ;D
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: scifidude79 on June 22, 2019, 05:39:57 am
Why in Pepper Mint will not install the Pale Moon browser by default? It is the best. ::)

I recommend, pay attention - http://www.palemoon.org/

Why? One simple answer is that it's not in the Ubuntu repositories. To install it on Ubuntu or an Ubuntu based system, you have to enable a PPA. PPAs are fine, but PCNetSpec likes to not have a bunch added by default, as they can cause issues. (they usually don't, but it can happen) The only PPA enabled by default is the Peppermint one, which PCNetSpec himself maintains, so he knows exactly what's in there.

Another reason why is that it's not up to PCNetSpec to determine what is the best for others. He prefers to have basic functionality out of the box by installing the tools required to run the OS in Live mode for those who want to test it extensively and those who run it that way without installing it. Other than that, he leaves any other software choices up to the individuals.

I personally think Firefox is the best, I use it wherever I can, even on my mobile phone. So, having Palemoon installed by default would be no less convenient for me than having Firefox is for you. Back when Peppermint came with Chromium by default, one of my first post install steps was to replace it with Firefox.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Johan on June 22, 2019, 06:17:45 am
Best browser is offcourse Firefox  :P

But Firefox 68 beta I'm not happy with because they changed back the scrollbar from dark to light:

Fx 68: https://i.ibb.co/09YxX1b/Screenshot-2019-06-22-12-11-15.png

Fx 67: https://i.ibb.co/34qw8yK/Screenshot-2019-06-22-12-16-57.png

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on June 22, 2019, 08:12:45 am
Why in Pepper Mint will not install the Pale Moon browser by default? It is the best. ::)

I recommend, pay attention - http://www.palemoon.org/

Why? One simple answer is that it's not in the Ubuntu repositories. To install it on Ubuntu or an Ubuntu based system, you have to enable a PPA. PPAs are fine, but PCNetSpec likes to not have a bunch added by default, as they can cause issues. (they usually don't, but it can happen) The only PPA enabled by default is the Peppermint one, which PCNetSpec himself maintains, so he knows exactly what's in there.

Another reason why is that it's not up to PCNetSpec to determine what is the best for others. He prefers to have basic functionality out of the box by installing the tools required to run the OS in Live mode for those who want to test it extensively and those who run it that way without installing it. Other than that, he leaves any other software choices up to the individuals.

Precisely this ^^, couldn't have said it better myself :)

I will NEVER add third party repos to Peppermint, and I'm not going to compile palemoon on launchpad every time there's an update .. now if palemoon themselves had a launchpad PPA I could copy it across from for testing that might be different (and I might even add it to ICE), but even then I doubt we'd ever use it as the default.

[EDIT]

Do they even make the source code available .. I can't find it (though I haven't looked very hard).
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on June 22, 2019, 10:41:45 am
Fx mem usage is starting to creep up again...   ::)


(http://vindsl.com/images/Screenshot_2019-06-22_07:04:32.png)


I was afraid to leave Fx up n' running, while I was off-premises. Fx has now been running 51 hrs (single window).

'Web Content' is using 2.12 GB and rising, as I type. At some point, it'll go south and eat the whole enchilada.

Machine uptime is 62+ days - bots are running in multiple Chromium windows - all other browsing in Opera.

Took Fx (and company) 1 day to become the #1 mem hog  ;D


(http://vindsl.com/images/Windowshot_2019-06-22_07:21:23.png)


I'll keep a close eye on it this weekend. It's either a mem leak in Fx or a runaway process IMO...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: murraymint on June 22, 2019, 10:53:59 am

Do they even make the source code available .. I can't find it (though I haven't looked very hard).

I think this is supposed to be it:

https://github.com/MoonchildProductions/UXP
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on June 22, 2019, 01:15:06 pm
@VinDSL

Someone here
https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/352433/high-ram-and-cpu-consumption-by-this-process
suggests turning on hardware acceleration fixed it for him.

layers.acceleration.force-enabled          true
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on June 22, 2019, 01:29:05 pm
@VinDSL

Someone here
https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/352433/high-ram-and-cpu-consumption-by-this-process
suggests turning on hardware acceleration fixed it for him.

layers.acceleration.force-enabled          true

I'll try it, Chief. Thanks.

On another front, I think I might have been staring at the prob, the whole time...


(http://vindsl.com/images/Selectionshot_2019-06-22_09:33:24.png)


I'm not really a Firefox fanboi (ahem), so maybe a legacy user can help me think this through.

My understanding is that this .jar file is supposed to be a temporary container, for serving suggestions to users, in the drop-down menu, when they start typing in addy bar - basically, reading one's mind. In this case, it would be gathering data on me, based on the music videos (it thinks) I'm watching and listening to, whether or not I'm sitting there or AFK.

Unless I'm misreading the situation, htop is indicating omni.ja isn't being released from mem after it's updated - maybe intentionally - maybe not.

If that's the case, and Fx is storing user data in a .jar, then there's no reason to keep it in memory when you close Fx.

Whatcha think?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on June 22, 2019, 02:22:52 pm
layers.acceleration.force-enabled          true

Okay, I did the deed, closed Fx, cleared the mem, restarted Fx, and we'll see what happens. Takes a day or so to crawl its way to the top of the processes heap - then a few more days to chomp all the remaining mem.  ;D

By the way, the acceleration is definitely working. I checked 'about:support'  and it's showing as "true".

Plus, my GPU is running almost 20C warmer. If I get thermal runaway, I'll need to set it back to default.

EDIT

Minimizing the window lowered GPU temps by 18C, so there's a workaround.

"That'll do pig, that'll do (ending to Babe) (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjQtzV9IZ0Q)," as Farmer Hoggett would say. LoL
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on June 26, 2019, 07:28:18 am
Hrm... A very strange thing has happened to me, over in Botlandia  8)

Conspiracies are real. Are you up for a conspiracy theory ?

First of all, the vid card  acceleration haxor (above) actually made the runaway RAM usage worse. It 'pegged the meter' in less than 24 hrs - Ram and GPU temps. so I reverted back to the default setting.

After observing things for a day or two, I finally decided to give up on the idea of monitoring my bots 24/7 using Firefox. Fx didn't *seem* to be up to the task.

Enter "Waddie"...

Waddie is a friendly bot, on the music site itself, that adds and extends functionality, depending on your auth. Without getting into it too much, it's similar to the CP functions in the SMF software that Peppermint OS Forums uses - users, trusted users, mods, and so forth.

The music site crashed yesterday, and Waddie hasn't come back online. Maybe the API is toast - who knows?

I'm starting to smell a rat. I have a *feeling* that Waddie, the bot, is harvesting cryto in the background, while ppl are watching/listening to music - which is fine. Sites need to support themselves, one way or another. Bandwidth isn't cheap.

Anyway, Fx RAM has simmered down, during Waddie's absence.  It's no better or worse than Opera. They're trading spots back n' forth in htop. However, sadly (or not) Chromium is still the winner, for stability and longevity. A simple F5 refresh, every 4-5 days puts Chromium back on course.

We'll see what happens when Waddie returns.  ;)

Continuing...
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on July 13, 2019, 02:39:21 pm
Got it! I FINALLY found a workaround  8)

Took me a couple of weeks of farting around, but I'm starting to like Fx again, so it wasn't a wasted effort.

If you'll remember (above) Fx was consuming all of my RAM, given enough time i.e. being active 24/7.

I won't get into all of the conventional trials n' errors, while haxoring Fx itself, but none of them worked.

Anyway, it was just a matter discovering the right mixture of addons and haxoring their various advanced settings.

The addons I ended up using were uBlock Origin (https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock#ublock-origin) and Tab Reloader (https://add0n.com/tab-reloader.html) (page auto refresh).

uBlock Origin required some site-specific tweeks, in its advanced settings dashboard, but I won't bore you with them, since it's unlikely you'll be monitoring your Chromium DJ bots on Dubtrack.fm using Fx.

After messing with Tab Reloader's dashboard, to no avail, I ended up basically leaving it alone e.g. OOTB install.

The only remaining glitch was to RE-ENABLE autoplay in Fx. This was accomplished by unchecking the followng box:


Code: [Select]
about:preferences#privacy => Permissions section => Block websites from automatically playing setting => Exceptions… =>  https://www.dubtrack.fm => Allow => Save Changes 
Simple pimple, really. It just took awhile to separate the wheat from the chaff...  ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on July 13, 2019, 05:05:32 pm
Cool, glad you figured it out in the end .. ya gotta love addons :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on July 13, 2019, 08:00:06 pm
Cool, glad you figured it out in the end .. ya gotta love addons :)

Yup! That uBlock Origin addon is golden.

Several minutes after a refresh, Dubtrack.fm throws a popup, inviting ppl to join the site.

uBlock Origin has an 'Element picker mode' that allows one to easily block the popup.

It also allows blocking ALL popups on a site - and a lock to make changes permanent, after debug.

Seems like uBlock Origin just keeps getting better and better...  :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on October 22, 2019, 08:41:46 am
Germany's cyber-security agency recommends Firefox as most secure browser
Germany's BSI tested Firefox, Chrome, IE, and Edge. Firefox was only browser to pass all minimum requirements for mandatory security features.

By Catalin Cimpanu (https://www.zdnet.com/meet-the-team/us/catalin.cimpanu/) for Zero Day (https://www.zdnet.com/blog/security/)

https://www.zdnet.com/article/germanys-cyber-security-agency-recommends-firefox-as-most-secure-browser/

This is impressive.  Although I still use Chrome beta or Brave for our occasional printing needs, Firefox, since Peppermint 9, has become my browser of choice.  Also, I like seeing that green padlock up there in the search bar.  That feature in and of itself is worth its weight in gold. :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Johan on October 22, 2019, 03:06:52 pm
According to Firefox 71 beta 3: Connection not secure. Parts of this page are not secure (such as images) Your cennection to this site  is not private  :-\
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on October 22, 2019, 03:30:19 pm
According to Firefox 71 beta 3: Connection not secure. Parts of this page are not secure (such as images) Your connection to this site is not private  :-\

Hi Johan,

For fun, try playing with Content Blocking in Preferences.  First try Strict, or playing with Custom, and see if that helps change anything.  I usually set my browser on Strict for content blocking, though I'm sure there's usually no need to do so.

perknh
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on October 22, 2019, 03:39:10 pm
According to Firefox 71 beta 3: Connection not secure. Parts of this page are not secure (such as images) Your cennection to this site  is not private  :-\

That just tells you that there are elements of the webpage you are viewing that come from non-SSL sites (http rather than https) .. it may be that the web page you're on is SSL (https) but some images that are being displayed or actually hosted elsewhere on a non-SSL (http) website.

For example:- this forum is SSL (https) but people are allowed to link to images from other websites that are not SSL.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Johan on October 23, 2019, 09:04:08 am
According to Firefox 71 beta 3: Connection not secure. Parts of this page are not secure (such as images) Your connection to this site is not private  :-\

Hi Johan,

For fun, try playing with Content Blocking in Preferences.  First try Strict, or playing with Custom, and see if that helps change anything.  I usually set my browser on Strict for content blocking, though I'm sure there's usually no need to do so.

perknh

It was set on Custom, but strict makes no difference.

Thanks Mark ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on October 24, 2019, 07:42:38 am
That just tells you that there are elements of the webpage you are viewing that come from non-SSL sites (http rather than https) .. it may be that the web page you're on is SSL (https) but some images that are being displayed or actually hosted elsewhere on a non-SSL (http) website.

For example:- this forum is SSL (https) but people are allowed to link to images from other websites that are not SSL.

Might using EFF's HTTPS Everywhere (https://www.eff.org/https-everywhere) extension help tighten up the non-SSL sites?

Firefox, since Peppermint 9, has become my browser of choice.  Also, I like seeing that green padlock up there in the search bar.  That feature in and of itself is worth its weight in gold...

Hey, what happened today to our green padlock in Firefox? :o  I just upgraded to Firefox 70 this morning, and I no longer see that bright green padlock in the search bar.  What a bummer! :(


P.S.

Okay, I just found this (https://techdows.com/2019/08/firefox-70-now-shows-grey-lock-for-https-sites-instead-of-green.html).  We've got to go into about:config to get it back.  You write in the word gray into the about:config search bar, and then you toggle off security.secure_connection_icon_color_gray.  That's all there is to it, and we've now got our little green friend back! ;)

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on October 24, 2019, 07:59:48 am
Might using EFF's HTTPS Everywhere (https://www.eff.org/https-everywhere) extension help tighten up the non-SSL sites?

It might .. it'd also likely block those images from non-SSL sites, so it's a choice you have to make.

I mean the images aren't really a security risk, but links to other content types such as scripts MAY be .. it's a balancing act .. personally I just bung on uBlock Origin and let it do the discriminating for me, but some people like to go further such as a script blocking extension like NoScript, but that too comes with its own inconveniences.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on October 24, 2019, 08:19:23 am
Might using EFF's HTTPS Everywhere (https://www.eff.org/https-everywhere) extension help tighten up the non-SSL sites?

It might .. it'd also likely block those images from non-SSL sites, so it's a choice you have to make.

I mean the images aren't really a security risk, but links to other content types such as scripts MAY be .. it's a balancing act .. personally I just bung on uBlock Origin and let it do the discriminating for me, but some people like to go further such as a script blocking extension like NoScript, but that too comes with its own inconveniences.


[EDIT]

I confused NoScript with ScriptSafe in an earlier post.  ScriptSafe, though a mighty little beast, also comes with too many inconveniences for everyday browsing use.

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: clatterfordslim on October 24, 2019, 07:19:53 pm
Loving the new Firefox 70 here in Pep 10, even more security than ever before plenty of blocking peers and trackers. Love the new logo too.  :D

  (https://imgur.com/Ui5dJjbl.png)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on October 24, 2019, 07:54:44 pm
I don't know how you created that page, clatterfordslim, but you've got a nice look there.  I'm very fond of dark themes, and your page there does a great job of highlighting the new Firefox logo. :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: clatterfordslim on October 24, 2019, 08:37:38 pm
I don't know how you created that page, clatterfordslim, but you've got a nice look there.  I'm very fond of dark themes, and your page there does a great job of highlighting the new Firefox logo. :)

Hi Perknh, Go into customize under the three lines on the far right of the screen in Firefox and under themes choose Dark,  also if you don't like the added search bars as default you can drag them out and into the box where all the other stuff you see in the big box below. Then hit done on the bottom right. It then comes out dark instead of the light theme. Also unlock Firefox Theme Lock in
Code: [Select]
Pep Menu/Settings


Absolutely loving Firefox. (https://vrcp.ru/smiles/dark/bs.gif)

(https://imgur.com/9qdpPUIl.png)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on October 24, 2019, 09:37:30 pm
Thank you, clatterfordslim. 

I'm already using a dark theme.  However I've never seen a Firefox themed homepage with DDG as its search engine until today.  Me?  I'm using Firefox's New Tab page with a dark theme.  It's simple but user-friendly.  I bet your homepage would look great with Firefox's Nightly theme too.  The blue "fox" is cool looking too. ;)

(https://i.imgur.com/beiYcf8.png)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Johan on October 27, 2019, 04:46:35 am
The dark theme in Customize, it's to dark for me personally. I use a Firefox theme called Argon experimental and when I open a new tab, it opens with a dark tab page.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: 151tom on October 28, 2019, 08:11:22 pm
I've stay with the default browsers that come with the Linux distro.

I like Firefox 70 in Peppermint 10 and I use Firefox ESR 68.2.0 in Antix 19 and they work great imo.

I've used PaleMoon and SeaMonkey and they worked OK.

I've used Chromium in Peppermint 8 and it worked OK although don't care for it now.

I used Google Chrome back in my Windows XP  days and thought it was great although I don't core for it now.

I'm happy with Firefox. :)


Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on October 28, 2019, 08:13:46 pm
Gimme Firefox or a glorious death, nothing else comes close .. Arrrgh (https://vrcp.ru/smiles/in07.gif) (https://vrcp.ru/smiles/light/co.gif)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: 151tom on October 28, 2019, 08:47:12 pm
Gimme Firefox or a glorious death, nothing else comes close .. Arrrgh (https://vrcp.ru/smiles/in07.gif) (https://vrcp.ru/smiles/light/co.gif)
Good One. ;D
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: clatterfordslim on October 29, 2019, 06:47:19 pm
Gimme Firefox or a glorious death, nothing else comes close .. Arrrgh (https://vrcp.ru/smiles/in07.gif) (https://vrcp.ru/smiles/light/co.gif)

And especially feel the absolute love for Firefox on (https://vrcp.ru/smiles/in04.gif) A peppermint Dizzy would be nice, rubbing a giant Peppermint or licking one. :))
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on October 30, 2019, 01:19:26 pm
.. it's a balancing act .. personally I just bung on uBlock Origin and let it do the discriminating for me, but some people like to go further such as a script blocking extension like NoScript, but that too comes with its own inconveniences.

No question about it, uBlock Origin makes using YouTube, and surfing the web, a much more pleasant experience.  An ad in front of your face every time you want to watch a video clip sure gets old after a while.  I'm hoping Quad9's DNS service will help block any real time threats for us, and I appreciate uBlock Origin continually updating its lists in order to block both dangerous and nuisance sites. 

I'm also using HTTPS EVERYWHERE, and I'm still stumbling frequently upon non-secured sites.   Do I really need to use Privacy Badger, I don't know.  Privacy Badger uses heuristics, and, in theory, its use makes sense to me.  I use Decentraleyes too, which, I'll admit, is a little esoteric.  Decentraleyes is on Firefox's recommended list, so it's probably a smart add-on to use.

This is its claim:

Quote
Protects you against tracking through "free", centralized, content delivery. It prevents a lot of requests from reaching networks like Google Hosted Libraries, and serves local files to keep sites from breaking. Complements regular content blockers.

-- Thomas Rientjes

Honestly, I can't see that I'm doing anything differently with my add-ons selection than what Brave browser is doing -- other than personalizing add-ons a little more, and doing so upon a more privacy-focused, Mozilla-based browser than that of a less privacy-focused, Chromium-based (Google) one.  (Yes, I still use Chrome at times, but not nearly as much as I used to.  In use it mostly for printing.)

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 18, 2019, 08:36:13 am
I've been beginning to question the merits of Brave browser.  This article, which I discovered yesterday, is making me think we might just be better off using Firefox or, if need be, Chromium or Chrome with a few added extensions such as uBlock Origin, HTTPS Everywhere, and Decentraleyes.

Perhaps I overreacted, but after reading this article, I removed Brave from my computer and phone.  (I'm now trying Firefox Preview on my phone.)  Although Brave's not a bad browser, perhaps it's not been all it's been cracked up to be.

Here (https://www.netsparker.com/blog/web-security/brave-browser-sacrifices-security/) is the article.  My only grievience with the article is that I see it somewhat conflates security with privacy; but just maybe in this case, the conflation of the two concepts is perfectly justified -- since it is discussing the whitelisting of Facebook within Brave browser's code.

Maybe, MAYBE, this whitelisting within Brave could be overruled with use of uBlock Origin -- I don't know.  All I know is that I've recommended Brave to a friend of mine running Peppermint because her computer, for whatever reasons,  cannot handle Firefox.  Now she's adopted, and fallen in love, with Brave browser.  And now I'm wondering if I should pull the recommendation I've given her for Brave, or just add uBlock Origin to the browser, and let things be. :-\



Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: clatterfordslim on November 18, 2019, 09:03:07 am

 All I know is that I've recommended Brave to a friend of mine running Peppermint because her computer, for whatever reasons,  cannot handle Firefox.

Has your friend got a SSD or a normal hard drive?? Ram can be a thing too, how much ram has she got? Sorry for the Spanish inquisition  ;D
"Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition" Monty Python.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAxkcPoLYcQ&list=PL-RQsZ-6oVvjx54Dh0eJtVLy5ZYNXJ6To&index=4&t=154s

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 18, 2019, 02:24:35 pm
I'm not a fan of Brave simply because they are attempting to control web advertising (actually in a quite bullying way, but that's another story) .. this IMHO puts them in a position which will inevitably be in conflict with the interests of their userbase.

But they'll fail anyway....
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 18, 2019, 02:39:46 pm
Has your friend got a SSD or a normal hard drive?? Ram can be a thing too, how much ram has she got? Sorry for the Spanish inquisition  ;D

I suspect her computer doesn't have a lot of ram -- probably 4, maybe 6 GBs of ram.  And, yes, it's a normal hard drive, not an SSD.  That one particular computer has ALWAYS had a choppy experience with FF.

I wonder if keeping Brave, but adding uBlock Origin to it, would override the defects of Brave's added code that have now been been brought to light.  I would assume, yes, but I don't know for certain. :-\

P.S.

And thanks for the Monty Python clip. ;D

I'm not a fan of Brave simply because they are attempting to control web advertising (actually in a quite bullying way, but that's another story) .. this IMHO puts them in a position which will inevitably be in conflict with the interests of their userbase.

But they'll fail anyway....

After reading that article, I'm much less of a fan of Brave today than I was yesterday.  But, in this particular case, do you think uBlock Origin might override that code with the Facebook permissions?

I would think it should, but I don't know. :-\  (I do know that uBlock Origin is a mighty little beast.)

And, yes, there is a conflict of interest with Brave, and I can clearly see it now.

Facebook?  Please... ::)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 18, 2019, 02:40:33 pm
I've been beginning to question the merits of Brave browser [...] Perhaps I overreacted, but after reading this article, I removed Brave from my computer and phone.

I haven't purged Brave yet (I have 2 vers installed), but I never use it anymore.

With my recently restored faith in Fx, in mind... 

I've been using the Tor browser for security work and anonymity, which of course, is Fx based.

If you haven't installed the Tor browser lately, you might want to revisit it   ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 18, 2019, 02:46:43 pm
in this particular case, do you think uBlock Origin might override that code with the Facebook permissions?

Sorry perknh I can't answer that .. I don't use (and have no interest in) Brave so I have no idea.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 18, 2019, 02:49:04 pm
If you haven't installed the Tor browser lately, you might want to revisit it   ;)

No, I haven't used it since my Windows Vista days.  Thanks for the tip. :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 18, 2019, 03:01:36 pm
in this particular case, do you think uBlock Origin might override that code with the Facebook permissions?

Sorry perknh I can't answer that .. I don't use (and have no interest in) Brave so I have no idea.

No problemo, PCNetSpec.  Thank you.  I'm running out of options, so I'm going to give it a try.  Opera, for Americans, isn't what it used to be.  Yandex, again for Americans, doesn't offer the some rights and protections as our European friends have on the other side of the Big Pond.  Chromium is so-so to pretty good usually, and Chrome's a no-go in this case.  From what I can see, I'm pretty well stuck with having to play with Brave browser.

Thanks, again, PCNetSpec and everyone here who's contributed to this discussion.  We'll give uBlock Origin a go here.  Can't beat its price either!  ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 18, 2019, 03:10:18 pm
What's up with Opera ?

media playback and DRM ? .. I can help you solve those.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 18, 2019, 03:20:42 pm
If you haven't installed the Tor browser lately, you might want to revisit it   ;)

No, I haven't used it since my Windows Vista days.  Thanks for the tip. :)

Let me know how it goes, please   :)


When I installed the Tor browser on this machine, somebody had poisoned the keys in Tor's repo.

LoL. I had a hella time finding a key that would work...  >:(

Extra Credit Reading (picked at random): https://is.gd/ej95HL
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 18, 2019, 04:39:36 pm
What's up with Opera ?

media playback and DRM ? .. I can help you solve those.

No, no, no...nothing like that!  I just meant we lost the privacy protection we had when we Americans had Opera's data privacy rights from Norway.  Fortunately you guys still do!  Those not in the EU get to fall under Singapore's data privacy laws. 


Let me know how it goes, please   :)


When I installed the Tor browser on this machine, somebody had poisoned the keys in Tor's repo.

LoL. I had a hella time finding a key that would work...  >:(

Extra Credit Reading (picked at random): https://is.gd/ej95HL

Thanks, VinDSL, I will, although I'm probably going to take a while.  I'm not able to squeeze in as much time online as I'd like these days. :(   Still, I try to reconnect here as often as I can.  That said, Peppermint forum is still my favorite site online. ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 20, 2019, 05:03:34 pm
If you haven't installed the Tor browser lately, you might want to revisit it   ;)

How did you install it, VinDSL?  I've never installed it in Linux. :-\
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 20, 2019, 05:51:51 pm
Instructions to install the current (English) version of the Tor Browser in 64bit Peppermint .. see end for 32bit Peppermint instructions....

Open a terminal and run these commands in sequence:
Code: [Select]
mkdir ~/.tor-browser
then
Code: [Select]
cd ~/.tor-browser
then
Code: [Select]
wget https://www.torproject.org/dist/torbrowser/9.0.1/tor-browser-linux64-9.0.1_en-US.tar.xz
then
Code: [Select]
tar xvf ./tor-browser-linux64-9.0.1_en-US.tar.xz
then
Code: [Select]
cd ~/.tor-browser/tor-browser_en-US/Browser
then
Code: [Select]
./start-tor-browser --detach
click the "Connect" button.

Once Tor starts, close it down again.

Once closed, run:
Code: [Select]
cp -v ~/.tor-browser/tor-browser_en-US/start-tor-browser.desktop ~/.local/share/applications/start-tor-browser.desktop
Tor Browser should now be in your menu at:-

Menu > Internet > Tor Browser



32bit Peppermint

To install Tor Browser in 32bit Peppermint, change the 2 instances of:-
tor-browser-linux64-9.0.1_en-US.tar.xz
in the commands above to:-
tor-browser-linux32-9.0.1_en-US.tar.xz



To UNINSTALL
Code: [Select]
rm -rv ~/.tor-browser
then
Code: [Select]
rm -v ~/.local/share/applications/start-tor-browser.desktop
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 20, 2019, 08:24:44 pm
@PCNetSpec

Thank you for the instructions.  I'm so glad I asked.  I would have been lost without them.   I did bend your instructions a little.  I wanted to first put Tor Browser on Ubuntu 19.10 in order to give it a look-see.  It installed without a hitch.  I will soon be adding it to Peppermint.


@VinDSL

If you haven't installed the Tor browser lately, you might want to revisit it   ;)

VinDSL, I have this to say about the new Tor Browser:

 :o 

I'm astonished!  This is not how I remember Tor from yesteryear.  I enabled HTTPS Everywhere, and I added uBlock Origin and Decentraleyes.  I also bumped up its security from standard to safer.  Looks to me like it's going to be a keeper. I can see myself using Tor Browser for shopping this holiday season.  Thanks so much for giving me a nudge.  It will surly be a handy browser to have on hand. :)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 20, 2019, 09:52:01 pm
Now perknh, you just need to (in Tor) visit:-

https://start.peppermintos.com (https://start.peppermintos.com)
or
https://start.peppermintos.com/perknhs-personal-startpage.html
or
https://start.peppermintos.com/perknhs-personal-startpage2.html

click the button labelled "Click here to add Peppermint search to your browser" .. and when asked, tick "Make this the current search engine"

Then set the Peppermint startpage as your browser start/home page .. and you're all sorted ;)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 20, 2019, 10:12:05 pm
@ Chief: Just got back to the abode. Thanks, for walking perk through the install...  ;)

VinDSL, I have this to say about the new Tor Browser:

 :o 

I'm astonished!  This is not how I remember Tor from yesteryear.

Yeah, the Tor browser used to be a real kludge. They've sure changed it up, didn't they   ;D

I L-O-V-E the new Tor Circuit button, in the addy bar. Click it, and it instantly wipes everything; and, gives you a new identity...


(http://vindsl.com/images/Windowshot_2019-11-20_20:06:24.png)
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 20, 2019, 10:22:13 pm
@ Chief: Just got back to the abode. Thanks, for walking perk through the install...  ;)

No worries, but if he doesn't change the search engine, you can pay me the few pennies I'll loose from DDG :P
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: perknh on November 21, 2019, 10:49:06 am
...set the Peppermint startpage as your browser start/home page .. and you're all sorted ;)

Of course, absolutely.  Done! :)

Yeah, the Tor browser used to be a real kludge. They've sure changed it up, didn't they   ;D

I L-O-V-E the new Tor Circuit button, in the addy bar. Click it, and it instantly wipes everything; and, gives you a new identity...

They sure did.  Yes, I've added the Circuit button.  Now I've got to learn when and how to use it.

Thanks, gents.  Tor browser is a winner! ;)
Title: Removing Tor Browser
Post by: peppycrab on November 21, 2019, 11:58:03 pm
I "test drove" Tor and found it wasn't for me. I followed the instructions above and Tor was removed. However, it is still listed in my menu under "Internet" . How do I remove it? I am running Peppermint 8.
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 22, 2019, 12:24:39 am
They sure did.  Yes, I've added the Circuit button.  Now I've got to learn when and how to use it.

Thanks, gents.  Tor browser is a winner! ;)

Tor rawks!  Look, perk...

They think I'm in Germany right now, on a corporate network, via Firefox, on top of winders 10  :))


(http://vindsl.com/images/Selectionshot_2019-11-21_22:16:48.png)

Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: clatterfordslim on November 22, 2019, 12:38:27 am
Now perknh, you just need to (in Tor) visit:-

https://start.peppermintos.com (https://start.peppermintos.com)
or
https://start.peppermintos.com/perknhs-personal-startpage.html
or
https://start.peppermintos.com/perknhs-personal-startpage2.html

click the button labelled "Click here to add Peppermint search to your browser" .. and when asked, tick "Make this the current search engine"

Then set the Peppermint startpage as your browser start/home page .. and you're all sorted ;)

This is really good in Firefox, loving it  ;D
Title: Re: Removing Tor Browser
Post by: Johan on November 22, 2019, 05:14:43 am
I "test drove" Tor and found it wasn't for me. I followed the instructions above and Tor was removed. However, it is still listed in my menu under "Internet" . How do I remove it? I am running Peppermint 8.

Did you try sudo apt autoremove?
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: Slim.Fatz on November 22, 2019, 06:31:21 am
They think I'm in Germany right now, on a corporate network, via Firefox, on top of winders 10


Hi VinDSL,

I'm crazy about this tor browser !! In every new tab that I open, and then visit

www.ipaddress.com/what-is-my-ip-address/ (http://www.ipaddress.com/what-is-my-ip-address/)

it shows me to be at another location (just now, three tabs: one shows me somewhere in Germany, one shows me somewhere in France, and the third in Montreal, Canada -- and each time on some sort of Windoze release, such as Win10 or Win NT  :D )

Super!!  8)

Regards,

-- Slim
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: VinDSL on November 22, 2019, 08:48:29 am
Tor browser FTW !!!   ;D







Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: The Omen on November 22, 2019, 12:18:33 pm
Hi Everyone,

I am doing this without TOR browser but using Brave Browser with "Trace" ext. as well as my usual ad block/anti-tracking extensions.

Brave builds in a TOR Browser into it, but i never use the TOR private window function since I think I am doing OK already without it.

It will change address every time I re-open the browser and will also "lie" by saying that my browser and OS is not what it really is.

Right now it is saying I am using Windows with the Safari Browser. I do not think that Safari will even work on Windows so I think this is a good fake out.


thismachine.info
Browser & Operating System information

What Browser am I using?

You appear to be using:
Safari 12
on Windows


Request   105.179.75.69
IP Address Lookup
IP Address   105.179.75.69
Hostname   n/a
IP Address Location
Country   Rwanda (RW)
ISP   Olleh-Rwanda-Networks
Connection Type   Cable/DSL
Timezone   Africa/Kigali
Local Time   Fri, 22 Nov 2019 19:09:52 +0200
Latitude/Longitude   -2.0000,30.0000
Tor Relay Details
Relays   This IP is not identified to be a Tor Relay

I am in the U.S.A.

Regards,

The Omen
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: esjay on November 22, 2019, 01:45:42 pm
Hello everybody!

Strong love for Firefox and also for Epiphany. Especially Epiphany is the browser I am paying attention to. I like the fact that there is a non-Chromium based browser next to Firefox around. I know that Epiphany is not working in all situations with 100% of satisfaction guaranteed (3.28.5 needs to be updated for sure, as 3.34.1 is there with sandboxing technology). But even 3.28.5 (3.28.6 is waiting for SRU) with firejail is a strong combo.   
Title: Re: Removing Tor Browser
Post by: peppycrab on November 22, 2019, 02:41:33 pm
I "test drove" Tor and found it wasn't for me. I followed the instructions above and Tor was removed. However, it is still listed in my menu under "Internet" . How do I remove it? I am running Peppermint 8.

Did you try sudo apt autoremove?

Tor was removed but I still have the shortcut under Menu/Internet.

UPDATE: Solved, using Settings/Menu editor
Title: Re: Best Browser
Post by: PCNetSpec on November 22, 2019, 03:29:15 pm
This should remove the launcher (so remove it from the menu):
Code: [Select]
rm -v ~/.local/share/applications/start-tor-browser.desktop