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Author Topic: 32 bit Petition  (Read 1304 times)

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Offline zebedeeboss

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Offline VinDSL

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2019, 03:20:18 pm »
Might want to get 64 bit working right, before killing 32 bit.

Just saying...  :D







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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2019, 03:51:55 pm »
So the whole point is people think Ubuntu will be hosting ZERO 32bit packages, and therefore things like WINE and Steam won't work ?

I'd be pretty sure they'll still do something like the old ia32libs package so that stuff continues to work .. Ubuntu aint gonna shoot themselves in the foot by removing ALL 32bit support. They're just trying save the manpower of maintaining (patching) 32bit packages, as far as I know nobody said "no 32bit support AT ALL".

IMHO everyone's reading far too much into this .. it **WILL** mean the end of 32bit Ubuntu based distros, I seriously doubt if it'll mean the end of gaming on Ubuntu.
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Offline scifidude79

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2019, 06:26:48 pm »
Ubuntu would be totally shooting themselves in the foot, even more than they have been recently, if they did away with gaming.

Also, WINE has a 64-bit version. So, it's available in distributions that don't have any 32-bit packages. Does it work well? I don't know. There have been times where something hasn't worked in WINE 64 and the answer is to force a 32-bit Wine prefix.
« Last Edit: June 22, 2019, 06:28:46 pm by scifidude79 »

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2019, 07:25:11 pm »
You'd have to be nuts if you think Ubuntu would go to the lengths they have to include the nvidia drivers if they were gonna kill off gaming :)

They'll have a plan for sure .. it'd probably only require a comeback of something akin to ia32-libs (which is what provided 32bit compatibility prior to multiarch .. and in a lot of ways was a simpler solution).

I have no doubt though that they just mean "we're dropping 32bit software packages", not so much 32bit libraries (at least the ones required for 32bit compatibility for wine, steam, etc.).
« Last Edit: June 22, 2019, 07:35:37 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Offline scifidude79

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2019, 08:09:07 pm »
You'd have to be nuts if you think Ubuntu would go to the lengths they have to include the nvidia drivers if they were gonna kill off gaming :)

They'll have a plan for sure .. it'd probably only require a comeback of something akin to ia32-libs (which is what provided 32bit compatibility prior to multiarch .. and in a lot of ways was a simpler solution).

I have no doubt though that they just mean "we're dropping 32bit software packages", not so much 32bit libraries (at least the ones required for 32bit compatibility for wine, steam, etc.).

Yup, everything PCNetSpec said here sounds right to me. It's probably going to be the same 64-bit version of the OS we have now, with 32-bit stuff being installed where necessary. What they're likely going to be doing away with is the 32-bit .iso and 32-bit versions of programs with 64-bit versions, except for maybe stuff like WINE.

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #6 on: June 22, 2019, 10:23:09 pm »
Hmm, after listening to Alan Pope on BDLL tonight I'm not feeling as confident as I was earlier :( .. he's suggesting they're possibly going to drop ALL 32bit libs (which would effectively kill of steam and wine on Ubuntu >= 19.10) :o

I should add that he 'suggested' nothing is set in stone at the moment it's still just an internal discussion, and the Ubuntu team are going to be returning to work on Monday having to deal with the internet furore so we'll only then see what happens .. but Valve are taking it seriously enough that they're suggesting they'll not support or recommend Ubuntu from 19.10
https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2019/06/steam-announces-that-its-dropping-support-for-ubuntu

I'm willing to wait and see how this pans out before making any rash judgement, but if they decide to plough on regardless (which let's face it is their M.O. of late) and drop ALL 32bit libs (or even just include them only as a snap) I'm willing to bet this will kill desktop Ubuntu (certainly derivatives unless they rebase .. Ubuntu may be able to survive purely on IoT but derivatives won't).

I'm also willing to bet it'd kill em in the server room and corporate desktop environments too .. lots of software still requires 32bit libs such as virtualisation, legacy/bespoke software, many legacy printer (and other) drivers, etc. it's not just about games.

I'm having trouble believing they've actually thought this through and will do it, but we'll have to wait and see....

I understood their decision to drop 32bit ISO's, I would even understand them dropping full multiarch in their repos, but dropping ALL 32bit support libraries would IMHO be insane :-\
« Last Edit: June 22, 2019, 11:42:12 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Offline scifidude79

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2019, 12:11:17 am »
Does Alan Pope work for Canonical? (serious question, not sarcasm)

Offline zebedeeboss

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #8 on: June 23, 2019, 07:38:22 am »
you can read what he does here

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlanPope
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Offline scifidude79

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #9 on: June 23, 2019, 08:15:02 am »
you can read what he does here

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlanPope

Thanks. I don't know any of the peoples' names who work at Ubuntu besides Shuttleworth.

Offline 151tom

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2019, 03:38:27 pm »
Thanks 151tom .. I hoped knew had a feeling they'd see sense and row back on that, it would have killed them :)

Panic over :)
(though I'm not sure 'freezing' the 32bit libs at the 18.04 versions but including them in the repos for >= 19.10 will be permanently issue free either .. I mean how long will the 18.04 32bit libs keep working as everything else progresses including the libs they were built against ??? .. I'm not sure anyone's ever tried this)
« Last Edit: June 23, 2019, 05:37:07 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Offline scifidude79

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #12 on: June 23, 2019, 05:30:49 pm »
That only makes sense. Most other (but not all) distributions that are only available in a 64-bit .iso still let you install 32-bit programs.

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #13 on: June 23, 2019, 05:38:32 pm »
I'm not sure 'freezing' the 32bit libs at the 18.04 versions but including them in the repos for >= 19.10 will be permanently issue free either .. I mean how long will the 18.04 32bit libs keep working as everything else progresses, including the libs (such as libc) they were built against ??? .. I'm not sure anyone's ever tried this ???

And what about security .. will they be patched if vulnerabilities are discovered ?
(they'd damn well better be if companies pay for support via things like Ubuntu Advantage)

There's still a LOT of questions that need answering here, which Ubuntu still aren't communicating well.....

It feels a bit like it wasn't thought through (or wasn't meant to get out yet before it was thought through), and now they've been caught scrambling for answers to questions they weren't prepared for yet.
(no evidence for this, just the way it 'feels' to me)

I'm not knocking them (now) .. I guess these things happen, you have an internal discussion that leaks before it's a fully developed idea and the sh*t hits the public fan. Let's wait and see where they go with it, they're gonna HAVE to make a public statement now :)
« Last Edit: June 23, 2019, 05:56:43 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Offline scifidude79

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #14 on: June 23, 2019, 06:33:51 pm »
I think people need to quit reporting guesses and let the fine folks at Canonical figure something out and announce what it is. Internet rumors are really grating on my nerves lately, not just with this but with other things too. >:(