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Author Topic: 32 bit Petition  (Read 1170 times)

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Offline scifidude79

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #30 on: June 24, 2019, 09:37:48 am »
If you're downloading it from the web, you should be able to select more than two. They have a wide variety of desktops available. I dunno, maybe I'll try it out this weekend.

Offline kloos

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #31 on: June 24, 2019, 09:47:24 am »
Ok, I'm sure this would have been mentioned if it was an issue, but it needs to be asked...  If they do cut 32bit support, would this effect Peppermint running steam and the like?

Offline zebedeeboss

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #32 on: June 24, 2019, 09:56:57 am »
Probably yes - It will effect every single OS based off of Ubuntu.

Lets wait and see where this goes and what options become available if they are needed.

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Offline kloos

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #33 on: June 24, 2019, 10:07:27 am »
I'm sure the dev's here already are, but it's never too early to plan for disaster recovery so we are ready should the worst happen.

Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #34 on: June 24, 2019, 11:12:36 am »
Now isn't the time to panic (but it is probably the time to let Ubuntu know how foolish this would be), as you suggest it's time to look for options depending on how this pans out.

Personally I'm still of the opinion that Canonical will see (or be forced to see) the idiocy of this decision and will keep the core 32bit libs .. but rest assured we'll be keeping a close eye on developments and though we may be forced to abandon a 32bit ISO we have no intention of abandoning 32bit support in the 64bit ISO (whatever path that sends us down).

Luckily this won't affect the PM10 respin (as it'll still be 18.04 based), so we have 6 moths(ish) to see how this plays out before making any hard decisions .. though that obviously won't stop us evaluating options for PM11.

As Zeb wisely said:-

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Lets wait and see where this goes and what options become available if they are needed.
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Offline zebedeeboss

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #35 on: June 24, 2019, 01:06:57 pm »
Be Kind Whenever Possible...   It is Always Possible - Dalai Lama

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Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #36 on: June 24, 2019, 01:23:40 pm »
I figured they'd eventually climbdown listen to their users on this.

Thanks Zeb .. sense prevails :)
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Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #37 on: June 24, 2019, 01:31:30 pm »
Still not sure I like this bit though

Quote
We will also work with the WINE, Ubuntu Studio and gaming communities to use container technology to address the ultimate end of life of 32-bit libraries; it should stay possible to run old applications on newer versions of Ubuntu. Snaps and LXD enable us both to have complete 32-bit environments, and bundled libraries, to solve these issues in the long term.

I'm getting that sinking feeling they'll use this as an opportunity to try push snaps by somehow adding the 32bit libs back via a snap, and making sure only software installed as snaps can access them.
That too won't work as it woun't address the problem of leagcy hardware drivers working in NON snap software (such as printer/scanner/plotter/other legacy hardware drivers).
« Last Edit: June 24, 2019, 01:34:12 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Offline scifidude79

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #38 on: June 24, 2019, 06:22:33 pm »
I'd imagine, aside from the community outcry, Valve making public statements that they'll no longer support Ubuntu had a lot to do with this. Canonical has to know that they'll lose a lot of people if they can't run Steam.



Aside from the push to snaps that PCNetSpec pointed out, this part is bothering me too:

Quote
We will put in place a community process to determine which 32-bit packages are needed to support legacy software, and can add to that list post-release if we miss something that is needed.

At least for 19.10, expect for some stuff to not work right away. They're going to try and figure out what is needed, likely won't get everything and will then have to add it to the repositories after people try to install it and find out what is missing. It's going to be a mess at first.

Also, you have to love how they call it "legacy software," like that stuff isn't still being developed.

Offline stevesveryown

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #39 on: June 24, 2019, 08:09:56 pm »
I think people need to quit reporting guesses and let the fine folks at Canonical figure something out and announce what it is. Internet rumors are really grating on my nerves lately, not just with this but with other things too. >:(

It makes for great click-bait , whether written word or on platforms like YouTube.  Personally I have very little knowledge on this subject.  There are only a few people I know I would get the honest truth from, like our own PCNetSpec.  I'll bring up the discussion on my channel but I won't click-bait it.  We will have to wait and see what happens.  I won't abandon our Peppermint in the future and trust in the real 'Big Poppa Peppermint'!  ;D

Offline 151tom

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #40 on: June 25, 2019, 01:00:47 am »
So would dropping all 32 bit everything effect all users or just certain users as I'm still somewhat confused as to exactly what would change.


Offline zebedeeboss

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #41 on: June 25, 2019, 01:14:26 am »
Hi

There are still applications and games today that are written using 32bit libraries.  So yes on an individual use case - every single user could/would be effected depending on what software they use.  32 bit is still an integral part of Linux so for them to just say we are ending support was just plain silly.

Regards Zeb...
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Offline 151tom

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #42 on: June 25, 2019, 01:23:31 am »
OK that makes sense.

Thanks  :)

« Last Edit: June 25, 2019, 03:41:50 am by 151tom »

Offline VinDSL

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #43 on: June 25, 2019, 07:24:40 am »
I'm getting that sinking feeling they'll use this as an opportunity to try push snaps

Bingo! It's a business decision, at its core, and a reckoning, too.

Quote from: Ubuntu dev Steve Langasek
It's not very compelling to say that Canonical should continue bearing these costs out of pocket on the grounds that some other companies are unwilling to update their software to an ISA from this millennium.

Going forward, Ubu WILL eventually quit supporting i386 as an architecture. You can bank on that, but...

Quote from: Ubuntu dev Steve Langasek
There are a number of ways that 32-bit applications can continue to be made available to users of later Ubuntu releases.

If companies want to support their 32 bit users via Snaps, fine. But, Ubu isn't going to do it for them (for free).

That's the way I'm reading it...

Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: 32 bit Petition
« Reply #44 on: June 25, 2019, 07:41:06 am »
It's not just about applications, though corporate users would like their legacy bespoke apps to continue to work they have an expectation that their hardware peripherals continue to work. Canonical can say until they're blue in the face that it's not their fault but at the end of the day they are an OPERATING SYSTEM which isn't much good if stuff doesn't OPERATE under.

Every other base distro is managing to keep core 32bit libs even where they've dropped 64bit ISOs and full multiarch, and I think it's a bit of a stretch for Canonical to suggest they're paying for this when they don't author the libs, they just rebuild them against their libc version.

This (to me) isn't a business decision (after all, their climbdown proves they know it would kill them), it's politics with a currently hidden agenda.

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