Choose style:

Author Topic: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows  (Read 487 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline VinDSL

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 3887
  • Karma: 723
  • Peppermint Mod
    • View Profile
ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« on: April 14, 2018, 08:12:29 am »
"These days Microsoft is busy open sourcing software’s and tools. It has now unveiled a tool to assist the Linux distribution managers.

The tool will help in bringing their preferred Linux distros to operate on Windows Subsystem for Linux (WSL). It is actually a compatibility layer for the functioning of Linux Binary executables on Windows 10.

In addition, the tool will also provide a compatible kernel interface proposed by Microsoft which can then operate a GNU on top of it, including SUSE Linux Enterprise Server, Kali Linux, Ubuntu and open SUSE."

SOURCE: https://goo.gl/43ZjYt

Offline PCNetSpec

  • Administrator
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 21016
  • Karma: 2369
  • "-rw-rw-rw-" .. The Number Of The Beast
    • View Profile
    • PCNetSpec
  • Peppermint version(s): Peppermint 8 Respin & 9 Alpha
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2018, 12:47:30 pm »
Cool, but who cares ?

I mean AFAIK it doesn't allow GUI stuff, and is more aimed at sysadmins .. who I wouldn't think would bother.
WARNING: You are logged into reality as 'root' .. logging in as 'insane' is the only safe option.

Team Peppermint
PCNetSpec

Offline emegra

  • Global Moderator
  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1657
  • Karma: 383
  • New Forum User
    • View Profile
  • Peppermint version(s): Peppermint 9 64bit
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2018, 01:26:06 pm »
I can't understand why any Linux enthusiast can get excited about this shite, this is for Microsofts benefit and nobody else, this Linux subsystem for Windows will only damage Linux, and there's not a damn thing we can do about it.

You'd think their 90% market share would be enough for them wouldn't you



Graeme
If you can keep your head while all around are losing theirs then you're not quite grasping the situation

Offline PCNetSpec

  • Administrator
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 21016
  • Karma: 2369
  • "-rw-rw-rw-" .. The Number Of The Beast
    • View Profile
    • PCNetSpec
  • Peppermint version(s): Peppermint 8 Respin & 9 Alpha
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2018, 02:14:27 pm »
It's not going to damage Linux either .. as i said, nobody cares.

a) As long as it can't run GUI stuff, it's useless to thee average Windows user

b) why would a Linux sysadmin want to administer Linux under Windows ?

c) if it ever gains a GUI so it can run Linux distros...

i) Do you think Windows users will like Linux, and if they do why keep Windows

ii) Why would any Linux user abandon Linux just to run Linux on Windows

iii) In either case they'd still be running Linux

I can't see that it'd do any harm to Linux, if anything I'd say on the contrary (if it gains a GUI) it might open a few peoples eyes to Linux .. but for the vast majority it's just a 'peculiarity' to look at, wonder why, then discard and forget about.

The only harm it could do is if the Linux devs embrace it and Microsoft try their EEE tactics .. but they'd be doomed to fail because of licensing and the way Linux is built.
WARNING: You are logged into reality as 'root' .. logging in as 'insane' is the only safe option.

Team Peppermint
PCNetSpec

Offline emegra

  • Global Moderator
  • Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 1657
  • Karma: 383
  • New Forum User
    • View Profile
  • Peppermint version(s): Peppermint 9 64bit
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2018, 03:02:29 pm »

Quote
i) Do you think Windows users will like Linux, and if they do why keep Windows
Some might like Linux but there's that killer application they just can't do without or killer game, Photoshop, itunes, Office etc, this will give them the best of both worlds or at least appear to and keep those who may consider moving to Linux stay with Windows, I think Microsoft feel threatened by Linux and they will do what is in the best interests of Microsoft, this is their way to stave off that threat, they'll have considered this carefully and this is for their benefit not Linux or open source in general

Quote
ii) Why would any Linux user abandon Linux just to run Linux on Windows
They wouldn't, this is not aimed at them

Quote
iii) In either case they'd still be running Linux
maybe that depends on how you look at it but more importantly for Microsoft they're still running Windows


Graeme
If you can keep your head while all around are losing theirs then you're not quite grasping the situation

Offline PCNetSpec

  • Administrator
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 21016
  • Karma: 2369
  • "-rw-rw-rw-" .. The Number Of The Beast
    • View Profile
    • PCNetSpec
  • Peppermint version(s): Peppermint 8 Respin & 9 Alpha
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2018, 03:19:01 pm »
The only way it's going to make any difference is if you can run the ffull Linux GUI in Windows .. and if that happens, I couldn't care less if people get exposed to Linux (or Peppermint) via Windows .. they're still getting exposed.

At the end of the day, those that prefer Linux will ditch Windows, those that prefer Windows will stick with it, and those that want both will either run a Linux distro under Windows (as they might now with a VM or previously with WUBI) or realise dual booting is the best couurse.

In all cases nothing changes except a few (and I do mean few, most won't care) will get exposed to Linux .. which can only be a good thing.

I don't see this as a threat at all .. in fact

a) Microsoft are showing little interest in running GUI Linux.
and even better
b) They appear to be loosing interest in Windows altogether:
http://money.cnn.com/2018/03/29/news/companies/microsoft-restructuring-windows/index.html

If you remember, I said ages ago that at some point Windows would become a financially unviable proposition, Microsoft would attempt to turn it into a service, then drop it, and Linux would be what's left (eventually winning the desktop by resignation) .. I still hold true to this belief ;)

The desktop market is shrinking to the point where Microsofts 'proprietary' development model will no longer be worth the input, and other services will become much more attractive propositions for them to concentrate on.

[EDIT]

A question has just dawned on me...

I wonder if this "Linux subsystem" is more about preparatory work for ditching Windows altogether .. in a more "look you can control your old Windows server from Linux", you no longer need desktop Windows.
(probably not, but something to think about :) )

[EDIT2]

Much more likely that they're planning on ditching Windows, and just selling licenses for Linux on Azure (as suggested by that article) and this is just a way to start the ball rolling.

[EDIT3]

Heck they've even SAID it .. "Windows 10 will be the last version of Windows" .. then left it for people to interpret that as they chose.

Laying the groundwork ?
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 04:30:06 pm by PCNetSpec »
WARNING: You are logged into reality as 'root' .. logging in as 'insane' is the only safe option.

Team Peppermint
PCNetSpec

Offline VinDSL

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 3887
  • Karma: 723
  • Peppermint Mod
    • View Profile
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #6 on: April 15, 2018, 04:33:50 pm »

Quote
i) Do you think Windows users will like Linux, and if they do why keep Windows
Some might like Linux but there's that killer application they just can't do without or killer game, Photoshop, itunes, Office etc, this will give them the best of both worlds or at least appear to and keep those who may consider moving to Linux stay with Windows, I think Microsoft feel threatened by Linux and they will do what is in the best interests of Microsoft, this is their way to stave off that threat, they'll have considered this carefully and this is for their benefit not Linux or open source in general

Agreed!

All I use winders for is:
  • The Office Suite, to collaborate and communicate with the business world.
  • Plug n' play HDMI output, when I'm on the trot. Works great on hotel room TVs - no messing around.
  • Insider Preview 'Skip Ahead' Build. What can I say? I like breakage.
Peppermint for everything else.

I probably use winders once or twice a week, on average.

Offline PCNetSpec

  • Administrator
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 21016
  • Karma: 2369
  • "-rw-rw-rw-" .. The Number Of The Beast
    • View Profile
    • PCNetSpec
  • Peppermint version(s): Peppermint 8 Respin & 9 Alpha
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2018, 04:40:56 pm »
As I said, I don't care if some people eventually run Linux from within Windows (as they kinda used to with WUBI) .. the point is they're still running Linux.

and a percentage of those will decide they no longer need Windows (as I've seen happen with some WUBI users a few years ago), and the ones that decide they don't like it and go back to just Windows would have anyway.

But none of this makes any difference until Linux in Windows can run GUI stuff .. which so far doesn't seem to be Microsoft's intention, probably for the reasons i just mentioned.

This is NOT aimed at 'desktop' Windows users.



They say "ALL press is good press" .. Thanks Microsoft :)

I can't see how this could possibly be 'bad' for Linux unless it's an attempt at embrace/extend/extinguish .. but the GPL won't allow that.



Killer apps .. mark my words "coming t a Linux near you".

Look at gaming over the last couple of years....

I'd put money on Microsoft releasing Office for Linux soon (as they wind down Windows).

And Adobe aren't just gonna say "well darn, if Microsoft are winding up Windows, we may as well just go home"
(remember the "we're dropping flash for Linux" .. then back it came)

Linux will continue to grow (because of its development model), whilst the other two continue to shrink .. live by the market forces sword, die by the market forces sword .. develop outside those market forces via free contribution and distribution and it's pretty much guaranteed you'll be what's left when the market shifts (though it'll probably be a smaller market by then) .. simplez. ;)
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 05:02:13 pm by PCNetSpec »
WARNING: You are logged into reality as 'root' .. logging in as 'insane' is the only safe option.

Team Peppermint
PCNetSpec

Offline VinDSL

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 3887
  • Karma: 723
  • Peppermint Mod
    • View Profile
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #8 on: April 15, 2018, 05:34:00 pm »
I'd put money on Microsoft releasing Office for Linux soon (as they wind down Windows).

Heh! If they do, it'll probably require RHEL or some such distro  :D

The online version (Office 365) runs fine of Peppermint. I used it for a year or two, but nothing emulates the original, like the original. You know?

 

Offline VinDSL

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 3887
  • Karma: 723
  • Peppermint Mod
    • View Profile
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #9 on: April 15, 2018, 05:43:38 pm »
Insider Preview 'Skip Ahead' Build. What can I say? I like breakage.

BTW, speaking of breakage ...

I'm downloading 'Preview Build 17643' (Redstone 5) in the background, as I type.

Damn thing has borked the last 3 attempts (updates approx. once a week).

I get a stop code and BSOD in the final phase, saying there's a page fault in a nonpaged area.

See what you're missing? LoL!

Offline VinDSL

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 3887
  • Karma: 723
  • Peppermint Mod
    • View Profile
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #10 on: April 15, 2018, 06:12:01 pm »
w00t!

I think I figured it out - maybe - sorta. We'll see after the download is complete.

While I was typing that last message, I started thinking about the page file size. I remember that I set the page sizes manually a while back - probably 3 weeks ago. Doh! So, I put it back on auto-sizing.

Possible PEBKAC. Can't be that simple, right  ::)




Offline PCNetSpec

  • Administrator
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 21016
  • Karma: 2369
  • "-rw-rw-rw-" .. The Number Of The Beast
    • View Profile
    • PCNetSpec
  • Peppermint version(s): Peppermint 8 Respin & 9 Alpha
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #11 on: April 15, 2018, 08:03:03 pm »
Microsoft announced Win10 will be their last, and everyone took that to mean "ah, they're going rolling release" (but remember, they've never really clarified what they meant) .. Ask Gnome or KDE if that's possible (?), or if they'd agree any complex code base that continually gets added to and subtracted from eventually ends up as an unsupportable tangled mess, requiring a fresh 'from the ground up' restart.

Microsoft as software developers would be well aware of this...

So I'm left to wonder if Microsoft either just meant the name (which to me doesn't seem like the best marketing ploy ever, specially in the consumer market), or if they already knew they had no long term plans for Windows beyond using it in the short term to promote their other growing services, such as pushing developers and sysadmins onto Linux on Azure.

And hence their sudden love of all things Linux, including becoming a massive (currently the largest ?) committer to the Linux code.

Microsoft are not stupid, they pay people to study markets and react accordingly, for quite some years now the real money hasn't been in the OS market itself (heck they're giving it away left right and centre, Win10, and all the 'free to OEM' versions, and free to schools/cities/etc. deals), it's been in the services surrounding 'computing' in general which are often, or could easily be made OS agnostic. It makes little sense for them to keep spending ever increasing amounts of money on OS development in a shrinking market with ever diminishing returns, when they could easily leave the OS development costs to others (with a better 'cost to product' model) then sell those same (growing) services to those users .. personally I think Microsoft REALLY DO love Linux, and are helping prepare it become the primary OS they sell those services for, now that's the smart proposition.

Don't view this as wishful thinking, I really couldn't care less if Windows continues or not (Peppermint is here as a community project who's goal is to please and encourage that community, full stop/period, we're not here to try 'win' Windows users .. heck if that were the goal I'd probably not badmouth their OS so much :))), it's just that I consider Microsoft a very astute business, and that's the direction the markets are leading them.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 09:03:18 pm by PCNetSpec »
WARNING: You are logged into reality as 'root' .. logging in as 'insane' is the only safe option.

Team Peppermint
PCNetSpec

Offline christianvl

  • Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 138
  • Karma: 24
  • The Wheel weaves as the Wheel wills
    • View Profile
  • Peppermint version(s): 8
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #12 on: April 16, 2018, 06:26:58 pm »
Microsoft announced Win10 will be their last, and everyone took that to mean "ah, they're going rolling release" (but remember, they've never really clarified what they meant) .. Ask Gnome or KDE if that's possible (?), or if they'd agree any complex code base that continually gets added to and subtracted from eventually ends up as an unsupportable tangled mess, requiring a fresh 'from the ground up' restart.

Microsoft as software developers would be well aware of this...

So I'm left to wonder if Microsoft either just meant the name (which to me doesn't seem like the best marketing ploy ever, specially in the consumer market), or if they already knew they had no long term plans for Windows beyond using it in the short term to promote their other growing services, such as pushing developers and sysadmins onto Linux on Azure.

And hence their sudden love of all things Linux, including becoming a massive (currently the largest ?) committer to the Linux code.

Microsoft are not stupid, they pay people to study markets and react accordingly, for quite some years now the real money hasn't been in the OS market itself (heck they're giving it away left right and centre, Win10, and all the 'free to OEM' versions, and free to schools/cities/etc. deals), it's been in the services surrounding 'computing' in general which are often, or could easily be made OS agnostic. It makes little sense for them to keep spending ever increasing amounts of money on OS development in a shrinking market with ever diminishing returns, when they could easily leave the OS development costs to others (with a better 'cost to product' model) then sell those same (growing) services to those users .. personally I think Microsoft REALLY DO love Linux, and are helping prepare it become the primary OS they sell those services for, now that's the smart proposition.

Don't view this as wishful thinking, I really couldn't care less if Windows continues or not (Peppermint is here as a community project who's goal is to please and encourage that community, full stop/period, we're not here to try 'win' Windows users .. heck if that were the goal I'd probably not badmouth their OS so much :))), it's just that I consider Microsoft a very astute business, and that's the direction the markets are leading them.
This is very interesting. And It looks like MS may release a Linux based OS or some Linux distro:

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2018/04/microsofts-bid-to-secure-the-internet-of-things-custom-linux-custom-chips-azure/

Software business is changed and MS knows it. Nobody wants to be "the next Kodak case".

Enviado de meu Lenovo TB-8504F usando Tapatalk

There are neither beginnings or endings to the turning of the Wheel of Time. But it was a beginning.

Offline PCNetSpec

  • Administrator
  • Hero
  • *****
  • Posts: 21016
  • Karma: 2369
  • "-rw-rw-rw-" .. The Number Of The Beast
    • View Profile
    • PCNetSpec
  • Peppermint version(s): Peppermint 8 Respin & 9 Alpha
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #13 on: April 16, 2018, 08:04:17 pm »
I doubt if they'll release a "distro", at least not for the desktop. Possibly an embedded Linux image for IoT devices, that requires little end user support and maybe just an update every now and then .. but they're not going to want to compete with Linux on the desktop or server with their own Linux as they'd have to support it.

They're much more likely to just contribute code to desktop Linux but leave end user support to the Canonical's/Debian's/Redhat's/Suse's/third parties of this world, then just sell massively profitable end user and corporate services where support can be automated to a large degree.

Who bets Office 365's subscription model will soon be the only way to get Office .. and then there'll be a Linux version (and/or there will be a fully featured subscription OS agnostic  web version, and the current crippled free online version will become more crippled)

Heck I bet they could port the Mac version of Office in a couple of days if they wanted .. and remember, they ARE trying to push corporations towards Linux on Azure .. so a Linux Office makes a LOT more sense than it used to when they considered Linux a cancer "competition".



On another note - I'm amused that everyone seems so convinced I've lost the plot here that they're not saying anything .. LOL :))
« Last Edit: April 16, 2018, 08:14:40 pm by PCNetSpec »
WARNING: You are logged into reality as 'root' .. logging in as 'insane' is the only safe option.

Team Peppermint
PCNetSpec

Offline pin

  • Trusted User
  • Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 998
  • Karma: 107
  • Peppermint + awesome wm
    • View Profile
  • Peppermint version(s): Peppermint 9 (64bit)
Re: ARTICLE: Tool released to run more Linux distros on Windows
« Reply #14 on: April 17, 2018, 03:20:18 am »
Quote
On another note - I'm amused that everyone seems so convinced I've lost the plot here that they're not saying anything .. LOL :))
« Last Edit: Today at 02:14:40 by PCNetSpec »

I'm just waiting to see how things evolve... Hmm! Where did I hear that before?  ;)

It could actually be positive and, if not... well, there's always BSD out there.