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Offline Pikolo

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Mintupdate suggests downgrading my kernel
« on: January 10, 2017, 03:24:49 pm »
I'm running 4.8-32 kernel, and it works like a charm. Recently, an update landed in the repositories, to both kernel branches Ubuntu 16.04 provides: 4.4 and 4.8. Unfortunately, by default, mintupdate would downgrade me to the 4.4 kernel branch, despite having the 4.8-34 image avaliable as well.
Is there a way to switch the kernel updates mintupdate suggests? I could just turn off level 5 updates as it's done in Mint proper, but I don't want to.

Offline Slim.Fatz

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Re: Mintupdate suggests downgrading my kernel
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2017, 03:40:48 pm »
Hi Pikolo,

My personal opinion of mintupdate is probably not permitted to be printed on a public forum! I never use such programs. I stick to starting the Synaptic Package Manager (it has NEVER failed me in years of use), clicking the Status button (if it is not already your default), then clicking the Reload button and looking at what (if anything) is listed as Installed (upgradable).

My advice is: forget mintupdate, (I know, your next question is probably this: why is it installed in Peppermint Seven? But, as I said: this is my personal opinion). I suggest: start using Synaptic;)

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« Last Edit: January 10, 2017, 03:43:47 pm by Slim.Fatz »
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Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: Mintupdate suggests downgrading my kernel
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2017, 03:44:23 pm »
What's the output from:
Code: [Select]
dpkg -l | grep 4.4.0

[EDIT]

Slim.Fatz opinion is ABSOLUTELY his personal opinion, and NOT one mirrored by Team Peppermint .. I have NEVER had mintupdate let me down either, why would it, it uses te same apt/dpkg backend as Synaptic.

Nor does his post answer your question.

Why is it included in Peppermint .. Erm because it works.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2017, 03:50:38 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Offline Pikolo

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Re: Mintupdate suggests downgrading my kernel
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2017, 03:54:32 pm »
Code: [Select]
pshem@PiLenovo ~ $ dpkg -l | grep 4.4.0
ii  linux-generic                         4.4.0.57.60                                amd64        Complete Generic Linux kernel and headers
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-24                4.4.0-24.43                                all          Header files related to Linux kernel version 4.4.0
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-24-generic        4.4.0-24.43                                amd64        Linux kernel headers for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-38                4.4.0-38.57                                all          Header files related to Linux kernel version 4.4.0
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-38-generic        4.4.0-38.57                                amd64        Linux kernel headers for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-43                4.4.0-43.63                                all          Header files related to Linux kernel version 4.4.0
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-43-generic        4.4.0-43.63                                amd64        Linux kernel headers for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-45                4.4.0-45.66                                all          Header files related to Linux kernel version 4.4.0
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-45-generic        4.4.0-45.66                                amd64        Linux kernel headers for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-47                4.4.0-47.68                                all          Header files related to Linux kernel version 4.4.0
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-47-generic        4.4.0-47.68                                amd64        Linux kernel headers for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-51                4.4.0-51.72                                all          Header files related to Linux kernel version 4.4.0
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-51-generic        4.4.0-51.72                                amd64        Linux kernel headers for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-57                4.4.0-57.78                                all          Header files related to Linux kernel version 4.4.0
ii  linux-headers-4.4.0-57-generic        4.4.0-57.78                                amd64        Linux kernel headers for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-headers-generic                 4.4.0.57.60                                amd64        Generic Linux kernel headers
ii  linux-image-4.4.0-24-generic          4.4.0-24.43                                amd64        Linux kernel image for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
rc  linux-image-4.4.0-31-generic          4.4.0-31.50                                amd64        Linux kernel image for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
rc  linux-image-4.4.0-34-generic          4.4.0-34.53                                amd64        Linux kernel image for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
rc  linux-image-4.4.0-36-generic          4.4.0-36.55                                amd64        Linux kernel image for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-4.4.0-38-generic          4.4.0-38.57                                amd64        Linux kernel image for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-4.4.0-43-generic          4.4.0-43.63                                amd64        Linux kernel image for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-4.4.0-45-generic          4.4.0-45.66                                amd64        Linux kernel image for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-4.4.0-47-generic          4.4.0-47.68                                amd64        Linux kernel image for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-4.4.0-51-generic          4.4.0-51.72                                amd64        Linux kernel image for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
rc  linux-image-4.4.0-53-generic          4.4.0-53.74                                amd64        Linux kernel image for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-4.4.0-57-generic          4.4.0-57.78                                amd64        Linux kernel image for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-extra-4.4.0-24-generic    4.4.0-24.43                                amd64        Linux kernel extra modules for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
rc  linux-image-extra-4.4.0-31-generic    4.4.0-31.50                                amd64        Linux kernel extra modules for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
rc  linux-image-extra-4.4.0-34-generic    4.4.0-34.53                                amd64        Linux kernel extra modules for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
rc  linux-image-extra-4.4.0-36-generic    4.4.0-36.55                                amd64        Linux kernel extra modules for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-extra-4.4.0-38-generic    4.4.0-38.57                                amd64        Linux kernel extra modules for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-extra-4.4.0-43-generic    4.4.0-43.63                                amd64        Linux kernel extra modules for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-extra-4.4.0-45-generic    4.4.0-45.66                                amd64        Linux kernel extra modules for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-extra-4.4.0-47-generic    4.4.0-47.68                                amd64        Linux kernel extra modules for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-extra-4.4.0-51-generic    4.4.0-51.72                                amd64        Linux kernel extra modules for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
rc  linux-image-extra-4.4.0-53-generic    4.4.0-53.74                                amd64        Linux kernel extra modules for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-extra-4.4.0-57-generic    4.4.0-57.78                                amd64        Linux kernel extra modules for version 4.4.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-generic                   4.4.0.57.60                                amd64        Generic Linux kernel image
ii  linux-libc-dev:amd64                  4.4.0-57.78                                amd64        Linux Kernel Headers for development
ii  linux-signed-generic                  4.4.0.57.60                                amd64        Complete Signed Generic Linux kernel and headers
ii  linux-signed-image-4.4.0-24-generic   4.4.0-24.43                                amd64        Signed kernel image generic
rc  linux-signed-image-4.4.0-31-generic   4.4.0-31.50                                amd64        Signed kernel image generic
rc  linux-signed-image-4.4.0-34-generic   4.4.0-34.53                                amd64        Signed kernel image generic
rc  linux-signed-image-4.4.0-36-generic   4.4.0-36.55                                amd64        Signed kernel image generic
ii  linux-signed-image-4.4.0-38-generic   4.4.0-38.57                                amd64        Signed kernel image generic
ii  linux-signed-image-4.4.0-43-generic   4.4.0-43.63                                amd64        Signed kernel image generic
ii  linux-signed-image-4.4.0-45-generic   4.4.0-45.66                                amd64        Signed kernel image generic
ii  linux-signed-image-4.4.0-47-generic   4.4.0-47.68                                amd64        Signed kernel image generic
ii  linux-signed-image-4.4.0-51-generic   4.4.0-51.72                                amd64        Signed kernel image generic
rc  linux-signed-image-4.4.0-53-generic   4.4.0-53.74                                amd64        Signed kernel image generic
ii  linux-signed-image-4.4.0-57-generic   4.4.0-57.78                                amd64        Signed kernel image generic
ii  linux-signed-image-generic            4.4.0.57.60                                amd64        Signed Generic Linux kernel image
I really like mintupdate. It automates updates, and clearly states what is upgraded into what. I'd like to continue using it, but having to untick the kernel downgrades every time takes a lot of the "automatic" magic out of it.

Offline Slim.Fatz

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Re: Mintupdate suggests downgrading my kernel
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2017, 04:04:35 pm »
Hi Pikolo,

Yes, as I stated: that is my personal opinion. But I must say that Synaptic also "automates updates" and "clearly states what is upgraded into what". And this is not surprising: as PCNetSpec said, "it uses the same apt/dpkg backend as Synaptic" -- which then leads to the next question: what does it (mintupdate) add that is really useful and not found in Synaptic? Why not just use Synaptic? But: to each his own.

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Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: Mintupdate suggests downgrading my kernel
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2017, 04:06:25 pm »
Okay, mintupdate keeps wanting to install the latest 4.4 kernel because you still have linux-image-generic installed.

BUT...

Allowing mintupdate to install the latest 4.4 kernel will NOT downgrade you from 4.8 it will just install the 4.4 kernel AS WELL (grub will always keep the highest version as the default though, so will continue to boot you into 4.8 )

You have 2 options

a) leave it as is, and let mintupdate keep updating the 4.4 kernel .. it will NOT affect the 4.8 kernel which will stay as the default kerenl
or
b) uninstall linux-image-generic

Personally unless you're strapped for space I'd go with (a) .. but I *would* manually remove some of the older 4.4 kernels you seem to be collecting ;)



Quote from: Slim.Fatz
which then leads to the next question: what does it (mintupdate) add that is really useful and not found in Synaptic?

An easily accessible panel applet with a great UI, and most importantly NOTIFICATIONS .. well you did ask ;)

Synaptic would also have carried on installing both kernels, so was not a solution.

You konw I love Synaptic, that's why we include it .. but MintUpdate does a useful job too.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2017, 04:15:41 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Offline Pikolo

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Re: Mintupdate suggests downgrading my kernel
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2017, 04:18:57 pm »
@Slim.Fatz Never used Synaptic consciously before. I checked the "upgradeable" section, and it also suggested upgrading the 4.4 series kernel.

@PCNetSpec That's slightly confusing, but good to know GRUB knows it's job. I though they were considered newest based on release date, and hence the update
Is there a rule on how many I should keep? I'll probably hold onto 2 of each: the last I know workes(probably the one I'm running) and the latest I can get

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Re: Mintupdate suggests downgrading my kernel
« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2017, 04:32:44 pm »
Is there a rule on how many I should keep? I'll probably hold onto 2 of each: the last I know workes(probably the one I'm running) and the latest I can get

Hi Pikolo,

Yes, that is a good stategy -- also similar to the one used by AndyInMokum and myself. Anything older is just taking up disk space.  ;)

Regards,

-- Slim
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Offline Pikolo

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Re: Mintupdate suggests downgrading my kernel
« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2017, 04:40:56 pm »
One more thing though: why isn't mintupdate, nor Synaptic proposing to upgrade the 4.8 kernel? With 4.8-32 installed and 4.8-34 is in the repository, they should :(

The kernel takes less than a MB so it's presence is negligible for my 500 GB HDD. But the thing that matters more is that kernel upgrades go noticeably faster when you have less kernels installed.

Edit: Actually, that was just one of the files. The whole kernel image seems to take ~50MB.
On top of this, that's what caught my eye in the update log: :-\
Code: [Select]
Setting up linux-signed-image-4.4.0-59-generic (4.4.0-59.80) ...
warning: file-aligned section .text extends beyond end of file
warning: checksum areas are greater than image size. Invalid section table?
Generating grub configuration file ...
« Last Edit: January 10, 2017, 04:49:22 pm by Pikolo »

Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: Mintupdate suggests downgrading my kernel
« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2017, 04:53:18 pm »
Me personally I have the current kernel and ONE (known to work) other .. which usually means the one just prior to the current one.

There's nothing stopping you removing ALL the 4.4 kernels if you have 2 known working 4.8 kernels .. but be aware the 4.8 kernels will never receive automatic updates, they will have to be updated manually from time to time (or not).

If you want to ditch all the 4.4 kernels, post the output from:
Code: [Select]
dpkg -l | grep 4.8.0
for comparison.

[EDIT]

Quote
One more thing though: why isn't mintupdate, nor Synaptic proposing to upgrade the 4.8 kernel?

Because kernel updates are triggered by an update to the linux-image-generic metapackage .. this then pulls in the new kernel and support packages as dependencies.
There is NO linux-image-generic metapackage for the 4.8 kernel so it cannot be automated .. though 4.8 is in the repos it was never intended to receive automated updates.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2017, 04:57:22 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Offline Pikolo

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Re: Mintupdate suggests downgrading my kernel
« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2017, 05:11:47 pm »
Code: [Select]
pshem@PiLenovo ~ $ dpkg -l | grep 4.8.0
ii  linux-headers-4.8.0-32                4.8.0-32.34~16.04.1                        all          Header files related to Linux kernel version 4.8.0
ii  linux-headers-4.8.0-32-generic        4.8.0-32.34~16.04.1                        amd64        Linux kernel headers for version 4.8.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-4.8.0-32-generic          4.8.0-32.34~16.04.1                        amd64        Linux kernel image for version 4.8.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
ii  linux-image-extra-4.8.0-32-generic    4.8.0-32.34~16.04.1                        amd64        Linux kernel extra modules for version 4.8.0 on 64 bit x86 SMP
If I understand correctly, HES(Hardware Enablement Stack) will bring 4.8 kernel autoupdating, right?

Anyways, thank you explaining this so clearly

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Re: Mintupdate suggests downgrading my kernel
« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2017, 05:42:03 pm »
When the LTS Enablement Stack is eventually release for 16.04 yes.

But for now if you want to get rid of every 4.4 kernel (and therefore the updates), the first thing I'd do would be to install the latest 4.8.0-34 kernel
Code: [Select]
sudo apt-get install linux-headers-4.8.0-34 linux-headers-4.8.0-34-generic linux-image-4.8.0-34-generic linux-image-extra-4.8.0-34-generic
once finished, REBOOT

Then post the output from:
Code: [Select]
uname -a
and
Code: [Select]
dpkg -l | grep 4.8.0
so I can check you are now booted into the 4.8.0-34 kernel, and have TWO known working 4.8 kernels.
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