Author Topic: Females using Peppermint ?  (Read 11770 times)

Offline MarkUK

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #60 on: February 02, 2017, 01:02:10 pm »
Friend of mine study CS in uni and he says some females are better at coding than he is ! He said sometimes HE is asking THEM questions. My jaw dropped when he said that to me. So I'm happy it slowly gets better. Very very very and one more time very slowly it gets better.  :)
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Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #61 on: February 02, 2017, 01:09:15 pm »
Not sure why you would find that jaw dropping Mark ???

I could maybe understand being surprised that ladies had joined the course in the first place, but not that the ladies with an interest would be good at it ;)
« Last Edit: February 02, 2017, 01:11:19 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Offline MarkUK

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #62 on: February 02, 2017, 01:18:44 pm »
Mark ... I just noticed you've got ICQ contact listed here. Are you really using ICQ ? I was using ICQ like 10 years ago. Inevitably it got replaced but I loved it. Although it is still available to download and use I wonder how many people actually actively using it for everyday communication in 2017.
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Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #63 on: February 02, 2017, 01:30:04 pm »
Not really .. I haven't used it in ages, but I may again at some point so I'll leave the contact intact for now :)

I don't really do Skype or Google Talk either .. but still have accounts (I think).

Maybe I just keep those icons on the left because they put me in mind of military ribbons, and make me look like some kind of high ranking hero type :))
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Offline spence

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #64 on: February 04, 2017, 05:14:19 pm »
To be fair to the younger crowd, I felt the same way at their age. Dad tried like the dickens to get me interested in coding back in the late 70's. I thought it was boring as all get out and only wanted to go outside and play. I was into botany & horticulture... the out of doors... Couldn't fathom a desire. need nor any wants for computers, much less coding them. Space Invaders was sorta cool on the Apple ][e he bought. I think I played it for a few weeks before becoming bored. I did not take it with me to college in the fall of '80. Didn't buy another until 1994, didn't go online for another two years. Dad was still urging me to go apply at AOL... ... ...
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Offline mac

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #65 on: February 04, 2017, 05:18:53 pm »
AOL....there's one I haven't thought of in years   ::)
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Offline perknh

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #66 on: February 04, 2017, 08:25:06 pm »
Sorry, gentlemen, but we're discussing females here --and AOL doesn't quite cut it!  How the heck did we go from females to AOL?   That's a question I DON'T want to know the answer to!  ;D

In the meantime:

Quote
Friend of mine study CS in uni and he says some females are better at coding than he is ! --MarkUK

&

Quote
I could maybe understand being surprised that ladies had joined the course in the first place, but not that the ladies with an interest would be good at it ;) --PCNetSpec

Agreed!  When I attended a small junior college in California years ago, everyone knew there the best students in math and logic usually came out of Asia and the Horn of Africa --at my school usually meaning Japan (especially for math) and Ethiopia (for BOTH math and logic).  And, believe me, it didn't matter what gender these students were.  Male or female, all of them were A students all the way.  I get it that biology and culture mix and mesh, but with brain power, honestly, I've never seen any difference between the genders at all.

I'll confess, I wanted to hear from LNXlady on this issue most of all:  The thesis of the video was so interesting, I was curious about whatever she'd have to say about it.  Our little sampling here in Peppermint has shown me that the video's thesis hasn't been debunked yet at all.  I find this, in and of itself, to be astonishing --that we are now tracing this disparity today between females and males, in in the world of computing, back to what happened with Apple computers and boys' and girls' bedrooms  back in 1984.  If this thesis is so, this is absolutley amazing, if you take a moment to think about it.  :o
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Offline MarkUK

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #67 on: February 05, 2017, 04:51:38 am »
Just to make things clear .... I didn't mean to offend females and I hope <em>nobody</em> got it that way.

I only expressed my amazement about the fact that friend of mine met females who seem to have greater knowledge and skill in computing than him 'coz in a last fifteen years of my interest in computing that never happened to me. I think I'll be very pleasantly surprised when I strike up a random conversation about IT and some female will have something to say to it. Wonderful day everyone !
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Offline perknh

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #68 on: February 05, 2017, 06:16:45 am »
Hi MarkUK,

With only three words and a question mark, you started one of the most interesting threads in the forum.  Thank you, MarkUK. ;)

This is an interesting topic and I'm now more convinced than ever that mores and socialization have historically played a huge role to create the gender gap we see in the world of computing now.  What I find so interesting it that much of this has happened right under our noses, but so few people seemed to notice it.  I mean we can see this clearly in other fields today.  Take swimming for instance:  You have to be able to wear a swimsuit in order to enter into a swimming pool, right?  If this assumption is correct, I don't expect to see many female divers and swimmers coming out of Saudi Arabia any time soon.  Why?  Socialization based upon the mores of a culture.  Maybe it's that simple.  But, when there's a phenomenon happening within our own culture, it seems to be much harder to see and to understand.

I suspect we'll see more women in computer related fields over time.  Young people, boys and girls, have equal access to computers and smartphones now.  I think the gender gap will eventually narrow.  But I still wonder, as you do, about Peppermint.  How do we have more gals to use Linux, or in our case, Peppermint?  You posed a very good question, MarkUK.  And I don't have an answer to it either.  :-\

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Offline LNXlady

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #69 on: February 05, 2017, 06:49:31 am »
Sorry, gentlemen, but we're discussing females here --and AOL doesn't quite cut it!  How the heck did we go from females to AOL?   That's a question I DON'T want to know the answer to!  ;D

In the meantime:

Quote
Friend of mine study CS in uni and he says some females are better at coding than he is ! --MarkUK

&

Quote
I could maybe understand being surprised that ladies had joined the course in the first place, but not that the ladies with an interest would be good at it ;) --PCNetSpec

Agreed!  When I attended a small junior college in California years ago, everyone knew there the best students in math and logic usually came out of Asia and the Horn of Africa --at my school usually meaning Japan (especially for math) and Ethiopia (for BOTH math and logic).  And, believe me, it didn't matter what gender these students were.  Male or female, all of them were A students all the way.  I get it that biology and culture mix and mesh, but with brain power, honestly, I've never seen any difference between the genders at all.

I'll confess, I wanted to hear from LNXlady on this issue most of all:  The thesis of the video was so interesting, I was curious about whatever she'd have to say about it.  Our little sampling here in Peppermint has shown me that the video's thesis hasn't been debunked yet at all.  I find this, in and of itself, to be astonishing --that we are now tracing this disparity today between females and males, in in the world of computing, back to what happened with Apple computers and boys' and girls' bedrooms  back in 1984.  If this thesis is so, this is absolutley amazing, if you take a moment to think about it.  :o

Well, I promised to be on my best behavior here for a while  but since you specifically asked I will say that I do believe there is some basis to this.  I have 3 brothers and I'm the only girl. I was treated differently. It's not a subject you want to get me started  on really. I was a good student but there was never any talk of college. My younger brother was even allowed to get his driver's  license before me. I can't say it's true for every family out there but my parents did not think I "needed" a computer or college or a driver's license or any number of other things I wanted and we didn't have a lot of money so if we didn't need something we weren't likely to get it. Computers were for boys. All the fun stuff was for boys, actually. Makes me wonder what lame people were in charge of deciding these things. Now, that's enough personal info. Mark me down as a believer. I do believe it has changed a lot and is still changing. I have friends with daughters and those girls are being told they can do whatever they want to do if they work hard at it. Those girls are going to college, some of them are going into the military, and I'm sure some of them will go into technology.

On the flip side, when I was a kid I knew a little boy who loved to play with dolls as a toddler. His parents allowed it when most wouldn't have. At the time, I thought it was a little creepy. Why should it be creepy? He was just a toddler. Now we have dolls that aren't so specifically and obviously girl toys but then dolls were all either female babies or Barbies. So, I do think someone was deciding what was ok for boys too, it just wasn't as limiting as it was for girls. Boys and girls are different but I think society has set up some unnatural barriers to separate us all further and it's unnecessary and possibly harmful. 

Offline MarkUK

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #70 on: February 05, 2017, 07:05:51 am »
Good talk lady & gents ......   :)

Let me just ask you LNXlady .. since you're running P7 did you have to tweak your system before you got it working the way you want ? Meaning .... it's a general knowledge that unlike Windows Linux does deal with incompatibilities with computer's hardware. Simply 'coz the crushing majority of computers on the market are designed to be operated under Windows. And Linux devs do their best to share their knowledge on how to eliminate those bugs.

Was your P7 up and ready out of the box or did you have to play with the terminal a bit to get it in shape  ?
« Last Edit: February 05, 2017, 07:17:18 am by MarkUK »
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Offline zebedeeboss

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #71 on: February 05, 2017, 08:03:21 am »
Hi

Irrespective of Gender, I will chirp in on that last Question.  P7 worked for me out of the box. I only had to add nvidia drivers this on a 2016 i7.  I also had a 2009 i5 that it worked on out of the box.  I also have an i5 Lenovo Laptop that worked out of the box.  Maybe I have been very lucky with my hardware?   Maybe it was because I chose my purchases wisely?  All I know is that what ever I throw at Peppermint 7  IT JUST WORKS   :D

Regards Zeb...

ps  Sure I tweaked and poked around since but I could have simply installed it and used it.  My nature doesn't allow me to do that though  :)
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Offline MarkUK

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #72 on: February 05, 2017, 08:57:25 am »
Good for you, zebedeeboss !

This is getting a little bit off-topic but anyways .....

Yes hardware awareness may play a part at how your system works. Of course. For example from my experience I had a lot of difficulties with getting my laptop making friends with Ubuntu 16.10. My laptop has all the bits inside with AMD mark on it and I learnt that Ubuntu 16.04 and 16.10 work well with AMD computers but only with specific models. As you can guess my bits weren't on the list and therefore my laptop experienced hiccups. (Had to switch from Ubuntu 16.10 to P7 'coz eventually I got this warning on the screen after installing all updates saying "An internal error occurred" and that was it . But quite frankly I don't really mind 'coz I learn loads along the way and that what really counts.

What supports what I'm saying here is also the fact the this forum is overflowing with people asking for an advice how to make P7 work. What workaround they should try and what command in terminal might help to fix the issue. Thank goodness for the forum ! I've found so many helpful contributors namely Mark Greaves from top of my head.

So yeah I dare to say you're lucky fella  ;)
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Offline perknh

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #73 on: February 05, 2017, 09:48:49 am »
Well, I promised to be on my best behavior here for a while...

That statement in and of itself demonstrates that our society still has different expectations from gals than from guys.

I have 3 brothers and I'm the only girl. I was treated differently...I was a good student but there was never any talk of college. My younger brother was even allowed to get his driver's  license before me. I can't say it's true for every family out there but my parents did not think I "needed" a computer or college or a driver's license or any number of other things I wanted and we didn't have a lot of money so if we didn't need something we weren't likely to get it. Computers were for boys. All the fun stuff was for boys, actually. Makes me wonder what lame people were in charge of deciding these things.

Me too, LNXlady.  Me too.  What's more we have to realize our parents were influenced by the culture in which they grew up in too.  And on and on it goes until something changes the pattern.  I'm just glad you fought back when you were so young against adult behavior that you clearly recognized as being unfair.  I wonder how many girls had similar experiences such as yours and then decided, for whatever reasons, not to fight back and assert themselves as you have done. :( 

So what's the best way to fight against gender bias, as well as a myriad of other biases plaguing humanity right now?  Personally, I'm a big fan of a secular liberal arts education --exploring as many directions of thought as possible.  Give everything a fair hearing, and then let the chips fall where they may.  So far I see this form of education as giving humanity the best chance of reaching its full potential.  If this is so, humanity sure have a long way to go...

Now, what's the best way to get gals to use Peppermint?  What do you think?  Might it be too late, as everything becomes more and more cloud-based over time?  With my own family, thanks in part due to our experiences with Web TV in the past, and a Chromebook now, I have to remind others over and over again that updating an OS is essential for its security and its functionality.  Now as platforms become more and more cloud-based, updating occurs in the background.  It seems to me as if fewer and fewer people want to deal with updates these days.  Could updating itself be what's holding back Linux for the desktop now?  Could it be that now, due in part to an historical accident discussed above, that the guys who are into Linux are here to stay, but that the gals won't be coming to us after all?   Although females have more access to a leveler playing field today regarding computers than ever before, the new perception for both guys and gals --even if incorrect-- is that OSes that update in the background are the way to go now? :-\
[T]here are a lot of people happily running Peppermint ICE which hasn't been receiving ANY updates for a while now .. and I personally would STILL consider that MUCH more secure than any version of Windows with up-to-date AV/Anti-malware ;)

--  PCNetSpec, Cornwall, Eng.  Dec 03, 2013 5:18 pm

Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: Females using Peppermint ?
« Reply #74 on: February 05, 2017, 11:40:17 am »
What supports what I'm saying here is also the fact the this forum is overflowing with people asking for an advice how to make P7 work. What workaround they should try and what command in terminal might help to fix the issue. Thank goodness for the forum ! I've found so many helpful contributors namely Mark Greaves from top of my head.

So yeah I dare to say you're lucky fella  ;)

Of course you'll find people asking for support on a SUPPORT FORUM .. the vast majority of people with no issues are unlikely to post are they ???

Doesn't mean what you see here is representative of how Peppermint works for the majority.

I'd stop building it if I thought that were the case.
« Last Edit: February 05, 2017, 11:45:40 am by PCNetSpec »
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