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Offline Elemec

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Thinking on adventuring on Slackware
« on: October 04, 2016, 08:58:52 pm »
Hi guys, Elemec here.
Remember some months ago i had a dillema wether have Peppermint os or a few other distros?

It's comming back. I tried venturing a bit further on Peppermint, a lot of bugs came and it became unusable (my fault).
I tried venturing into some weird Lubuntu-mate-xfce-kde-plasma-something frankenbuntu, unusable later (my fault).
Tried Sparky linux lxde for a few hours... Internet won't budget again... (my fault?).
Had a few happy weeks on Linux Mint Xfce, days later unusable and no internet at all (my fault).

I know going to Slackware might also cause problems and all, maybe even have myself do more mistakes as it would be new ground, but i was thinking a bit, i always hear about it's huge stability, reliability and potentially lightweightness (I even head about some dude that got a KDE setup running less resources than Peppermint os 7!) and overal "superiority", but also, it's bigger difficulty gap, as you seem to be expected to know what to do, and WHEN to do.

I got a bit of interest onto that, mostly because as i've heard, you're not needed to get all "dependencies" as you would on some cases (cough k3b cough), and overall, to give me more knowledge about Linux, so far the only things i know are small "get away commands" such as "sudo pkill -9 -u user". I thought a bit, and maybe using Slackware would give me more maturity Linux wise? As in, taking more care, more focus before doing changes that could harm my setup, learning more commands, checking out how it is to use Slack.

So, i would like to know you guys opinions on Slackware overall, and maybe which derivative i should use on the beggining for "training wheels"?
As far as i know the list goes around "Slax, Slackel, Salix"
All of them seem to be decently light, and may be the doors/windows (metaphor) to a whole "New World" Linux wise.

Well, that's kinda it guys, a bit disappointed with myself for being so quick to nuke that one Sparky Linux LXDE setup, seriously, wasn't even a day and i got a way to mess up the wifi as a whole  :(


Running Lubunt 16.04 as of now, it's really meh, it works for a bit, but looks a bit bad until i download more themes and also STILL has the Dropbox Infamy bug (Dropbox turns into a red X or something and won't budge unless sudo)

Offline AndyInMokum

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Re: Thinking on adventuring on Slackware
« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2016, 09:24:31 pm »
Hi Elemec, it good to know you're still pursuing Linux.  As for Slackware, it's very stable, that's a well know fact.  There are no repos as such though; at least not in the conventional sense we're used to.  To install new software packages, you'll need to compile them from source most of the time.  There are packages called Slackbuilds.  These are pre-configured binaries from the Slackware community. There is no guarantee they'll work on your machine.  When this happens, you'll end up having to compile the packages anyway.  Out of all the distros, it's the most UNIX like.  To the point that the devs at Slackware have opted out of using systemd

Slackware is in my opinion, unnecessarily old fashioned and extremely awkward to use.  It's most certainly not a distro for a newbie, or for someone with little to no experience in using the terminal.  I'm quite an experienced user.  I think Slackware is a true sadomasochists distro.  I would personally, rather stick needles into my eyes than use and maintain it  >:(
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Offline Elemec

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Re: Thinking on adventuring on Slackware
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2016, 09:35:43 pm »
Oh, didn't think on that perspective.
Well, aside from Ubu/Deb/Mint/Slack/Arch/Gent/extremelysmalldistroslikepuppylinux, what would you consider very stable? I'm trying to avoid the DEBian a bit for, well, these purposes, and would like to know your (in that case, everyone's) opinion, on the end of the day if nothing works, i'll have to deal with Lubuntu/Peppermint as the only really decent distros for me to use.

What i'm really looking for is to avoid the whole bleeding edge/rolling release, i've noticed that, as Sparky destroyed itself so fast in few hours, i wonder how it would have gone if i had actually installed all programs i needed. So, besides the Debian/Buntu/Mints, what distros have a reasonably long "Life time", as in LTS?

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Re: Thinking on adventuring on Slackware
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2016, 11:29:51 pm »
Hrm ...

We ran a Slack server, here at the house, for years.  It was hilarious to crank up a packet sniffer, and watch perps attack it.  The fools tried to break into it for (like) 10 years, non-stop, 24/7/365.  Slack is impenetrable, if you set it up right !  Eventually it died of old age.  The last time the HDD went read-only, we took it behind the barn and shot it.

That said, I would never use Slackware on a desktop nachine, but that's just me.  Classic mismatch ...

These days, I use CentOS for my production servers -- same thing.  I would never use CentOS on a desktop either, but you didn't ask about that.

I've run Peppermint on all my portables, since 2011.  It's my distro of choice, when I'm 2000 miles from home, in hotel rooms, convention halls, and airport terminals.  And, I'm now running Peppermint 7 on my desktop, which I've never done in past, except for testing/development.  That's how much I like it.  I'm also currently testing winders 10 & openSUSE Leap 42.1 on this machine. 

All 3 distros have been very stable, but I spend most of my time in Peppermint 7.  Actually, I have to force myself to use winders and openSUSE, but I digress.

Long story short, if it was me, I'd stick with Peppermint.  But, you knew I'd say that, right ?  ;D

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Re: Thinking on adventuring on Slackware
« Reply #4 on: October 05, 2016, 01:05:43 am »
You could always venture into the Red Hat side of the fence.  There's Fedora, Mageia and OpenMandriva.  Those are some good, stable operating systems that use Red Hat's .rpm package management.  Fedora has been around for ages and is very stable.  It's a community project, but it's sponsored by Red Hat.

Mandriva started off life as Mandrake Linux, another enterprise class Linux OS.  After some time, they became Mandriva.  Aside from their Enterprise class Linux, Mandriva also released a free version, which I actually quite liked back in the day.  A lot of financial issues and being bought out led to many of their employees being fired.  Those employees started Mageia, an open source project.  Much like Mandriva was in its day, Mageia is a very stable and very nice OS.  OpenMandriva is a similar project hat came out of the whole Mandriva mess.  After Mandriva shut their doors for good, a community group started OpenMandriva.  Like Mageia, OpenMandriva should be good and stable.

Anyway, those are a few stable systems I can think of that you can try if you want to get away from Debian based and the .deb package management system.  I've used them all at one point or another and think they're stable and very nice.  All of them have community forums to help you out as needed.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2016, 01:08:27 am by scifidude79 »

Offline AndyInMokum

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Re: Thinking on adventuring on Slackware
« Reply #5 on: October 05, 2016, 01:09:42 am »
Quote
...What i'm really looking for is to avoid the whole bleeding edge/rolling release, i've noticed that, as Sparky destroyed itself so fast in few hours,...

What on earth did you do to SparkyLinux to make it go belly up?  I've been dual booting the Xfce 64-bit version with a Peppermint 7, since February, (well it started off with Peppermint Six :) ).  It's not given me a lick of trouble  :-\.  Sure, I've stripped it down, tweaked it and installed the stuff I want.  The only thing I do to it, is do a full update and upgrade each Friday.  As far as I'm concerned, it's the best rolling release I've ever used  ;).  For sheer ease of use and stability out of the box.  It has to be Peppermint 7 all the way though  ;).
« Last Edit: October 05, 2016, 01:20:22 am by AndyInMokum, Reason: Amending the content. »
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Offline zebedeeboss

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Re: Thinking on adventuring on Slackware
« Reply #6 on: October 05, 2016, 01:34:54 am »
Hi Elemec

It would seem, to me anyway, you're problem is you like to "fiddle / tweak / alter" without really knowing what the outcome will be.   Going to Slackware will not solve that.

You need to teach yourself to install an OS and then "Just use it".  I have been an avid Distro hopper for many years now and like you, I felt the need to fiddle/tweak/alter the OS to the point of breaking it.  I would then blame the OS and move on.

Peppermit broke that habit - for me - it simply works - it is extremely stable.  It does everything I need and does it well and has been doing it since May/June 2015.

As AndyInMokum stated with any Slack distro you will spend more time maintaining the system and building packages than actually using it.  If I had to use an OS based on Slackware it would be Salix, but that is not an endorsement by any means -it was simply the only one I could get workig on my machine.

Stick with Peppermint, learn how it works, teach yourself to STOP messing with the settings - it is what it is and unless you can break this habit - you will NEVER have a stable OS.

All that said - Good luck with your Journey.   Mine has been 9 years so far and the first 7 were spent saying   "Linux is Crap - its not for the masses, it doesn't work - it keeps breaking"  I am a slow learner but the last two years have been much much better and now I can honestly say I feel "comfortable" installing and using Linux - on my equipment.   It is a journey and it will take time - Good Luck

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Offline GNULINUX

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Re: Thinking on adventuring on Slackware
« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2016, 05:45:57 am »
It would seem, to me anyway, you're problem is you like to "fiddle / tweak / alter" without really knowing what the outcome will be.   Going to Slackware will not solve that.
+1

Very recognizable... To keep me from reinstalling the system on a regular base I always install Timeshift.
Read more: System Restore for Peppermint: Timeshift

It has saved me more than once!  :)
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Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: Thinking on adventuring on Slackware
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2016, 08:17:20 am »
I'm with the other guys, pick a distro (any distro) and stick with it .. if you keep chopping and changing you'll never fully learn how to dig yourself out of a hole in any of them.

I've never really understood distro hoppers, besides the very good idea of wanting a quick look to decide which distro is a good fit for you which can (usually) be done via a "Live" session or VM .. learn ONE properly before moving on (or not).

Sorry if that's not what you wanted to hear, but one of the LAST distros (along with Arch and Gentoo) that I'd suggest for a distro hopper would be Slackware .. these distros more than any other REQUIRE that you spend time learning them inside out, if you're not the type that can do that you'll likely have a VERY bad experience.

[EDIT]

"Stability" -- Well that depends what you mean ?

If you mean one that will NEVER break, get an Apple .. OS X will likely never break because it won't let you change anything.

But if you mean something that ONCE SET UP is unlikely to break, Debian .. but it **will** take some effort to "get just right", and there's risk of breakage whilst doing that but once set up it's about as stable as you can get but you'll never have the latest software without adding repos that reintroduce the risk of breakage.

Middle ground .. any Ubuntu based distro .. Peppermint (?)

Pick ONE, and LEARN it .. OS's/distros (unless locked from change) are only as stable as YOUR knowledge.
« Last Edit: October 05, 2016, 08:32:31 am by PCNetSpec »
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Offline Elemec

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Re: Thinking on adventuring on Slackware
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2016, 08:23:26 am »
Thanks for all the replies guys, yes that's really my problem, i keep trying to "tweak" more and more in purpose of trying to see a lighter approach.
I'll see how the new Peppermint is going, and gonna try making a small fluxbox setup, and try to hold myself so i don't end up killing my machine again.
Yeah, going for Slack just because all the problems isn't going to fix any, good i asked you guys first, imagine how lost i would be if i actually ventured there  :D

Quote
...What i'm really looking for is to avoid the whole bleeding edge/rolling release, i've noticed that, as Sparky destroyed itself so fast in few hours,...

What on earth did you do to SparkyLinux to make it go belly up?  I've been dual booting the Xfce 64-bit version with a Peppermint 7, since February, (well it started off with Peppermint Six :) ).  It's not given me a lick of trouble  :-\.  Sure, I've stripped it down, tweaked it and installed the stuff I want.  The only thing I do to it, is do a full update and upgrade each Friday.  As far as I'm concerned, it's the best rolling release I've ever used  ;).  For sheer ease of use and stability out of the box.  It has to be Peppermint 7 all the way though  ;).
All i did was:
Install steam
Install dropbox
Put a few add-ons to remove ads n stuff on firefox
Did the "user friendly update-thing" they have.
Took like 2 hours and after the update everything was kinda broken

Offline Elemec

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Re: Thinking on adventuring on Slackware
« Reply #10 on: October 05, 2016, 03:09:25 pm »
Alright, i'm trying P7 while trying to have these goals "Stop trying to thinker so much!"
It's been pretty good, but i had 3 problems.
1- Installation (Live vers) crashed 2 times, and counted that as a full install, so i had absolutely no way to use this pc unless i installed a distro again.
2- Installation (Non-Live vers) was very buggy, but was the one that worked, not too big of a problem.
3- Steam isn't properly working, although i had the same problem with Sparky Linux LXDE

Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: Thinking on adventuring on Slackware
« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2016, 03:13:40 pm »
Is steam installed ? ?

How did you install it

What happens if you open a terminal and run:
Code: [Select]
steam
WARNING: You are logged into reality as 'root' .. logging in as 'insane' is the only safe option.

Team Peppermint
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Offline Elemec

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Re: Thinking on adventuring on Slackware
« Reply #12 on: October 05, 2016, 05:06:38 pm »
Is steam installed ? ?

How did you install it

What happens if you open a terminal and run:
Code: [Select]
steam
Yes.

Did a "sudo apt-get install steam"

Out come of steam is this :
Code: [Select]
elemec@elemecpc ~ $ steam
Running Steam on peppermint 7 32-bit
STEAM_RUNTIME is enabled automatically
[2016-10-05 18:05:53] Startup - updater built Sep 20 2016 18:20:24
SteamUpdateUI: An X Error occurred
X Error of failed request:  BadValue (integer parameter out of range for operation)

Offline PCNetSpec

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Offline Elemec

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