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Author Topic: And people say Windows is "easier"  (Read 4797 times)

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Offline perknh

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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #15 on: October 24, 2015, 04:41:21 pm »
Although I'm not a gamer, I find PCNetSpec's description above to have been exactly what I had experienced for several years with Windows.

It's been ages since I've had any serious issue with Linux at all --particularly Peppermint.  What was my last issue with Peppermint --a wayward ICE application?  And, before that?  Well, I needed brush up course from AndyInMokum as to how to remove old Linux kernels. 

And, before that?  Maybe it was some anxiety that an unsupported Peppermint 4 installation might have been causing my laptop computer to overheat.  Yes, I have to go back to Peppermint 4 for that one.  (And, by the way, it was this unsupported edition of Peppermint 4 that convinced my wife to replace Windows entirely and simply go with Peppermint 4.  See, that's how bad we thought Peppermint 4 was!)

Yup, you can all see now --my history of hardship with Peppermint Linux OS.  Clearly perknh's household has had a very tough time here using Peppermint Linux OS! ;D

... moving to Linux introduced me to the concept of free software and what it really means, Linux has actually changed the way I think and how I look at the world

Yes, that concept has also changed me, and how I see the world too.  Thank you, emegra, for bringing up this most important point --which, in the long run, is proving to be the most important point of Linux of all.
 

« Last Edit: October 24, 2015, 05:53:48 pm by perknh »
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Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #16 on: October 24, 2015, 04:47:45 pm »
How many of us have switched someone over to Linux only to find Windows .exe files in their Downloads folder

LOL .. I'd say ALL OF US :)

As I said, I'm not really a Windows hater (as long as I don't have to use/fix it) .. but because of what I do for a living I do find the occasional bit of Windows bashing strangely cathartic and theraputic :)
« Last Edit: October 24, 2015, 04:51:20 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Online VinDSL

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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #17 on: October 24, 2015, 06:20:29 pm »
I find there's a problem is installing software, somehow they just don't get package management, to me this is crazy because the package manager is probably the biggest advantage Linux has over Windows in terms of ease of use, personally I think it's because it's just too radically different from how it's done in Windows regardless of how easy it is.

I totally agree.  For instance, I ran openSUSE for a few years, as my primary distro - loved it, but...

OMG !!! Installing programs in openSUSE was a nightmare.  Debian forks are a cakewalk by comparison.

Being a seasoned Linux veteran, check this out, and tell me what you think:

http://opensuse-guide.org/installpackage.php    >:(

Imagine a first-time *nix user trying to install a program on SUSE...

Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #18 on: October 24, 2015, 07:02:15 pm »
I don't have to read it .. openSUSE was the first distro I tried (after a quick foray into RHL 4.1 around 97ish which scared the living **** outa me), YaST2 was a horrid experience.

and their "one click" installs used to fail about 110% of the time back then  :o

I gave up SUSE when the (new at the time) KDE4.1 desktop decided it wanted to load the panel applets before the system tray had started then chuck up errors, and I couldn't (at the time) find a fix .. put me right off SUSE and KDE (and RPM's) permanently.

Replaced it with Ubuntu Karmic and stayed with Ubuntu until Unity .. then after *trying* to get along with Unity and Gnome 3 (and wasting 6 months of my life)  and failing, came here.


[EDIT]

I remember Cakewalk :)
« Last Edit: October 24, 2015, 07:39:25 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Offline AndyInMokum

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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #19 on: October 24, 2015, 07:27:20 pm »
Quote
...Imagine a first-time *nix user trying to install a program on SUSE...
Five minutes of that would turn any nOOb into a gibbering idiot or make 'em suicidal  ::)!!
Backup! Backup! Backup! If you're missing any of these -  you ain't Backed Up!
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Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #20 on: October 24, 2015, 07:29:54 pm »
Quote
Five minutes of that would turn any nOOb into a gibbering idiot

Well that explains it then .. I spent WAY more than 5 mins with it, and apparently so did VinDSL :))

Wanna see a gibbering idiot .. give someone the RedHat Linux 4.1 floppy disk set and ask em to install it on a Win95 era PC  >:(
« Last Edit: October 24, 2015, 07:38:50 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #21 on: October 24, 2015, 07:44:21 pm »
Well that explains it then .. I spent WAY more than 5 mins with it, and apparently so did VinDSL :))

My first foray after openSUSE was Linux Mint Gloria (let's see if this ancient link works):





Back then, I couldn't stand Ubu, with their dirt-brown themes and all...   ;D

Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #22 on: October 24, 2015, 07:55:22 pm »
and green was better  :-\
« Last Edit: October 24, 2015, 08:01:16 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #23 on: October 24, 2015, 08:08:50 pm »
and green was better  :-\

You've commented on that before, and I never put the pieces of the puzzle together until now.

openSUSE was green, and Mint was green.  I've even made 'green' Ubu and Peppermint themes.

I guess I'm subconsciously drawn to 'green', from time-to-time, even though I don't like 'green'.

It must be some sort of psychological defect or something. 

Seriously, I don't like 'green'.  It repulses me, actually.

Hrm... I'll need to consult with Google Search on this...   :(

Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #24 on: October 24, 2015, 08:22:19 pm »
I thought you were going to say you needed to consult with the Google "Docs" on this.
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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #25 on: October 24, 2015, 08:29:28 pm »
LoL !  You're 'on' today...  :D

Offline scifidude79

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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #26 on: October 25, 2015, 01:37:27 am »
I get it...  you don't like windows... but if you are going to have a pop at windows - please do so with an example that is not so easy to put holes in  :P

I don't have to "take a pop" at anything.  Here's one word for which there is no rebuttal: viruses.  Windows has them, Linux doesn't.  A Windows user has to invest time and possibly money in installing virus software, updating it and running virus scans.  A Linux user doesn't.  End of story.

Offline zebedeeboss

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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #27 on: October 25, 2015, 02:39:24 am »
Here's one word for which there is no rebuttal: viruses.  Windows has them, Linux doesn't.

Yes it does - it's just a darn sight harder to catch a cold with Linux.

and may I apologise in public to everyone reading this thread if I have offended anyone with my retorts. It is not my intent and I definitely don't want to get anyone's backs up over it.  I love this place and the helpfulness of the experts in here.

I just get frustrated when people express an opinion as fact when my take on the matter is completely different.  I guess I just have to learn to be more tolerant of other peoples experiences and views of Windows. I promise to try harder  :)
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Offline perknh

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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #28 on: October 25, 2015, 05:39:55 am »
One thing this discussion has proven, however, it that Linux is actually easier to use than Windows.  We don't need all those extra programs we would need in Windows just to remain operational.  Although we can have an AV in Linux if we'd like, we don't have to have one to remain secure online. (Stay behind a NAT router, stick to programs within the repositories, keep updated, and don't click onto spam email.)  Also, there is nothing to defrag in Linux.  Installing and updating are also easier to do with Linux than with Windows.

If one uses Chrome OS as an example, all one has to do is open a Chromebook and start working.  We wouldn't have to do anything more than that. (All updates are done in the background.)   And with Ubuntu, Mint, and Peppermint, the most we really ever have to do is update when updates are available.   We don't have to configure anything.  We don't even have to upgrade with any of the --buntus, or their derivatives. (We do have to update and dist-upgrade when using a Debian testing distribution.)  We don't have to maintain an AV program.  We don't have to remove old Linux kernels.  If we just installed a new distribution every three to fives years (assuming we're going LTS), I'm certain we could get along just fine.  And, in those rare instances where we have a problem, or we have a question, we have a tremendous support forum which has already answered hundreds, if not thousands, of questions already.  But, still, no need to phone anyone.

Yes, I'm convinced that for ease of use, Linux really is the way to go. ;)
We're all Peppermint users and that's what matters  ;). -- AndyInMokum

Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: And people say Windows is "easier"
« Reply #29 on: October 25, 2015, 07:43:13 am »
In truth, Linux *can* (in some circumstances) be more difficult for a novice than Windows .. take (non HP) printer driver installation for an example, this is not a problem with Linux as much as with the manufacturers, but that gives little comfort to a new user.

But that doesn't mean Windows is "easier" than Linux .. sure Windows is *sometimes* easier to add peripherals to, though stupendously more time consuming and frustrating for someone that *does* understand Linux (and Windows) .. but if you don't run into those occasions Linux is most definitely easier, 99% of the time Linux just does it for you

Here's a question .. when the few hardware manufacturers that are left that don't put effort into doing open source drivers get onboard (and they will .. partially because of Android and Chromebooks), or when people buy their hardware with Linux in mind instead of "certified for Windows" .. would you still consider Windows "easier" ?

Like nearly everyone I know that has become proficient with Linux (usually after becoming proficient with Windows first), I remain convinced that for someone being given an empty PC for the first time, and with zero prior Windows or Linux knowledge, Linux would be easier to learn and faster to become productive on. Heck thanks to "Live" sessions they don't even have to figure out the installation procedure (which is easier in Linux anyway), or where to get software, or how to install it.

Anything beyond that siimple fact is purely "learned" behaviour and applies to either OS equally.

[EDIT]

@zebedeeboss

You'll never upset anyone here by just having a differing opinion my mate (and if you do, it's them that are in the wrong) .. in fact counterpoint is fuel for the discussion :)

I must however take you up on this:-

Quote
Yes it does - it's just a darn sight harder to catch a cold with Linux.

Can you show me one in the wild ? .. nearly all, if not all, Linux viruses have been proof of concept in the lab and never seen in the wild .. add to that the fact that any Linux virus that does make it into the wild finds it impossible to spread, and limited in any damage it can do, and whilst you're not wrong, it would be more accurate to say "at least for now it's as close to impossible to catch a cold in Linux that it may as well be considered non existant, and any virus even if they did exist would require your assistance before they could do any real damage to your system .. and that because they cannot spread and replicate they probably shouldn't be considered viruses in the first place".

« Last Edit: October 25, 2015, 08:46:39 am by PCNetSpec »
WARNING: You are logged into reality as 'root' .. logging in as 'insane' is the only safe option.

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