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Author Topic: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?  (Read 7574 times)

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Offline perknh

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #30 on: July 24, 2015, 06:57:43 pm »
But, PCNetSpec, Andy could be correct about this.  As Gandhi said, "When the people lead, the leaders will follow."  Who knows?  Maybe scifidude79 has kicked off a quiet little revolution to gently retire Flash from the world.  And to think this gentle revolution to retire Flash all began right here within Peppermint Forum.  ;)
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Offline AndyInMokum

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #31 on: July 24, 2015, 06:59:17 pm »
Something  has to be done about it.  Flash is becoming a liability and it's only going to get worse.  If Adobe won't do the right thing and pull the plug.  The next level in the food chain should start to take responsibility.  Flash is like cyber herpes.  It just won't go away  >:( 
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Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #32 on: July 24, 2015, 08:03:10 pm »
The ONLY people that can break this cycle other than the users (who won't whilst the big sites use it) and Adobe (who won't for obvious reasons) is the site authors.

They are the ONLY ones with the power to get rid of flash without interrupting content .. these are the people that need targeting, it's NOT a browser authors place to dictate web content accessibility and protocols, nor a user created problem.



I REPEAT .. I hate Flash with a vengeance, but if Firefox (or any other browser) tries to deny me access to Flash content, I'll drop that browser immediately.
(if for no other reason than a political statement .. I will NOT have them dictating to me what I do on the web, they can INFORM me of the risks, but the final decision to access flash or not has to lie with the user .. meanwhile site authors need to be tempted away from it, and that's happening anyway so there's no need to screw over users)
« Last Edit: July 24, 2015, 08:11:22 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Offline scifidude79

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #33 on: July 24, 2015, 08:11:06 pm »
The ONLY people that can break this cycle other than the users (who won't whilst the big sites use it) and Adobe (who won't for obvious reasons) is the site authors.

They are the ONLY ones with the power to get rid of flash without interrupting content .. these are the people that need targeting, it's NOT a browser authors place to dictate web content accessibility and protocols, nor a user created problem.



I REPEAT .. I hate Flash with a vengeance, but if Firefox (or any other browser) tries to deny me access to Flash content, I'll drop that browser immediately.

Yeah, what he said.  It's not the software providers' job, it's the site authors' job.  They have to kick Flash to the curb, which will make the plugin no longer useful and it will die a quiet death.  I'm not a fan of my web browser telling me what plugins I can and can't use either.  If I owned anything from Apple, who dropped Flash support, I'd be livid with them.  Because, without it, there is simply some stuff you can't view on the web.

Me choosing not to run it is something different.  The option is still there.  So, say I want to watch a show on Hulu.  (I'm in the middle of the first season of Lost in Space on there and may pick it back up at some point)  All I have to do is apt install flashplugin-installer and I'm good to go.  And, if that suddenly didn't work in Firefox, I'd just switch browsers to watch that show.

Offline VinDSL

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #34 on: July 24, 2015, 09:23:24 pm »
I agree what everyone has said above.  ;) 

This is what my local newspaper says when I visit its site:



I get those too, occasionally, on antiquated   legacy web sites.  The funny thing is... 

I can't say I've missed anything that I care about.  It's a great way to get rid of cruft on news sites - you know, the ones that autoplay videos, whether you want to see them or not?!?!?

Adobe might be "sorry", but I'm not...   :D


Offline perknh

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #35 on: July 24, 2015, 09:31:35 pm »
Hi VinDSL,

It is an antiquated site, and I'm still not going to enable Flash in Peppermint --no matter what it says.

I admit I always have fun here, and Gandhi* really is so quotable, but the truth is there has to be a global solution to this problem --meaning that the world's largest sites need to pull the plug on Flash.  That will do more than anything to resolve this problem than anything else.  I'm astonished here at the reports coming into Peppermint forum which name so many big sites that are still using Flash.  This, quite frankly, shocks me,  :o

Personally, I believe that Microsoft is actually the biggest culprit here for helping to keep Flash alive.  But I have no data to back up this claim.  This just seems like common sense to me.

*To the philosophically curious:   

Spoiler (click here to view / hide)
Using Gandhi as some sort of standard here, which I did in a previous post, is a form of fallacious thinking which is called "An appeal to authority."  I threw it in just because I like the quote.  On the other hand, a doctor can smoke and tell you that smoking is bad for your health.  Just because the doctor smokes does not mean that what he or she is saying is untrue.  In fact all scientific data will back up his or her claim whether or not the doctor smokes at all.
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Offline VinDSL

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #36 on: July 24, 2015, 09:58:36 pm »
Hrm...

I'm curious if switching UAs will make any difference.

Hrm... I think I'll pretend I'm using an Android smartphone...



I'm gonna find a site with Flash content and give it a whirl.   ;D
« Last Edit: July 24, 2015, 10:44:49 pm by VinDSL, Reason: Addendum »

Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #37 on: July 24, 2015, 10:30:32 pm »
I think the main sticking point  (and I could be wrong here) was the original lack of DRM in HTML5 which a lot of sites saw as necessary to protect their content .. leaving aside that's a stupid and disproven argument .. AFAIK, DRM has now been added, but not that long ago.

Point is .. Flash is dying anyway now, it doesn't need the web browser authors to hurt their users .. it's going to fade away all on its own (as evidenced by less sites using it now, and as sites are updated more of it will bite te dust).

But I'll GUARANTEE Firefox, Google, et al. will NOT disable flash support .. Firefox didn't, they just disabled it by default until the next version (all of a couple of days) .. if they dropped support altogether, their userbase would dry up overnight.....

Consider ths - If Mozilla and Google decided to drop support for Flash tomorrow, and Opera kept it (or any other browser) how many peolpe do you think would drop Firefox/Chrome and move to Opera when you consider 90%+ of Fekbook games are Flash ;)
(Ask Joe Average which is most important, their web browser of choice or access to Farmville/Candy Crush Saga/etc.)
« Last Edit: July 24, 2015, 10:35:05 pm by PCNetSpec »
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Offline VinDSL

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #38 on: July 24, 2015, 10:41:01 pm »
Aha!  Just as I suspected !!   8)

Found a stale news site with Flash content.

Here's a video in Chromium...




And, here's Chromium masquerading as an Android smartphone ...




Offline scifidude79

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #39 on: July 24, 2015, 10:49:22 pm »
It's a great way to get rid of cruft on news sites - you know, the ones that autoplay videos, whether you want to see them or not?!?!?

I know, right?  I'd rather see the "missing Adobe flash" thing than some of those autoplay videos.  In fact, autoplay videos are a pet peeve of mine.  If I choose to watch a video, fine.  If not, I shouldn't have it playing anyway, especially when I don't know it's there and I'm not expecting it (and probably don't have my speakers turned on.)  Stuff like that just slows your connection to other, better content that you're trying to load simultaneously.

Offline VinDSL

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #40 on: July 24, 2015, 11:16:51 pm »
...autoplay videos are a pet peeve of mine. 

Me too !!

I have to be pretty  desperate to visit an 'alphabet news site' ABC- CBS - NBC - CNN, et cetera. 

They're the worst offenders, in my experience.  They'll clobber you with 2-3 autoplay videos at the same time.

Offline VinDSL

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #41 on: July 24, 2015, 11:27:38 pm »
BTW, switching UAs is stupid simple, these days, via extensions.

Here's the one I use in Chromium:  https://goo.gl/YybG4
« Last Edit: July 25, 2015, 01:00:09 pm by VinDSL, Reason: Typo Demon Strikes Again »

Offline scifidude79

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #42 on: July 25, 2015, 02:46:17 am »
...autoplay videos are a pet peeve of mine. 

Me too !!

I have to be pretty  desperate to visit an 'alphabet news site' ABC- CBS - NBC - CNN, et cetera. 

They're the worst offenders, in my experience.  They'll clobber you with 2-3 autoplay videos at the same time.

Yeah, I hate it when all I want is to read an article on one of those news sites and it's trying ro play a video.  I like NASCAR racing, but they do that on their site too.  It breaks my heart that the NASCAR website uses Flash, so I can't get those anymore.  ;)  Steam has auto play vids, but you can easily disable that on the site.  That's good, because they use HTML5 instead of Flash.

I read a while back that Google was adding a setting to Chrome to allow users to stop videos from automatically playing, but I don't know if they actually did it.

Offline PCNetSpec

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #43 on: July 25, 2015, 07:18:21 am »
That's actually a great idea and something the browser devs *could* do .. if the browsers effectively had a flashblocker built in that simply required  you to click on flash content before it started to play website authors would quickly learn to code with HTML5 as their adverts would cease to function.

a) Users can still VERY easily access flash content

b) Site devs are encouraged to learn HTML5 for the adverts, and at the same time would be worried that the masses would get used to advert blocking.

I think a large part of the problem is there are a LOT of devs out there that know Flash and haven't bothered to learn HTML5 .. this will push them to learn or suffer the consequences.
« Last Edit: July 25, 2015, 07:40:42 am by PCNetSpec »
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Offline scifidude79

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Re: Having issues with Flash in Firefox?
« Reply #44 on: July 25, 2015, 12:03:51 pm »
Mobile browsers have the ability to only use plugins on demand due to mobile data usage limits.  I don't see why they can't do that for desktop browsers.